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Old 10-07-2011, 04:07 PM  
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If I remember correctly it was a democratic controlled congress that appropriated the funds. Can't put all the blame on Bush, the Dem's hands are just as dirty.
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Old 10-07-2011, 04:11 PM  
mohel
 
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Originally Posted by oldognewtrick View Post
If I remember correctly it was a democratic controlled congress that appropriated the funds. Can't put all the blame on Bush, the Dem's hands are just as dirty.
I did not like Tarp but I was wrong. It proved to be a shining success toward recovery compared to many other directions tried. Bush gets credit there but in the end no one from any party can point to a proven way to extricate a country from a depression or severe recession. NO ONE
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Old 10-07-2011, 07:07 PM  
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Originally Posted by oldognewtrick View Post
Almost 50 % of the citizens pay no income tax. How are the "rich" not paying their own way?
Jon Stewart did a piece on this awhile back:
Quote:
Jon Stewart: But you know what? Maybe they're right, maybe Fox is right, maybe the bottom 50% of Americans, while they already pay excise and payroll and medicare taxes, do need to pay more. I mean they can spare it, after all, they control 2.5% of our nations wealth. Oh then you know what? This is actually a pretty easy calculation, we can do this. The bottom 50% is just simple math, in dollar figures, the bottom 50% of this country have 1.45 trillion dollars in everything they own on this earth. So let's see they have 1.45 trillion dollars, what do you say we take, I don't know, half of that. That'd be, oh look at this, 700 billion dollars. Why does-why does that figure sound so familiar to me?
Chris Edwards speaking on Fox News: The president wants to raise the top two income tax rates, which would raise about 700 billion dollars over 10 years, you know what that's only a tiny fraction of the federal government's deficit.
Jon Stewart: So raising the income tax rate on the top two percent of earners would raise 700 billion dollars but taking half of everything the bottom fifty percent have in this country would do the same, I see the problem here. We need to take all of what the bottom 50% have. All of it! It's the only way to make a significant dent!
My answer to you is: If on top of sales tax, gas tax, social security tax, etc, you want the bottom 47% to also pay income tax, THEN PAY THEM ENOUGH THAT THEY HAVE A TAXABLE INCOME.

There. Problem solved.
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Old 10-07-2011, 07:18 PM  
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.................

then pay them enough that they have a taxable income
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Old 10-07-2011, 07:28 PM  
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Originally Posted by rivalarrival View Post
Jon Stewart did a piece on this awhile back:


My answer to you is: If on top of sales tax, gas tax, social security tax, etc, you want the bottom 47% to also pay income tax, THEN PAY THEM ENOUGH THAT THEY HAVE A TAXABLE INCOME.

There. Problem solved.
Rival, I agree with you, a lot of the working class deserve to make more.

Our problem is not a revenue problem at the federal level, we have a spending problem. Do you have a budget at your house (our govt doesn't)? Or do you spend twice your yearly income thinking, well if I spend more all the problems will be solved. I'll just borrow another 200 grand from blucher, he may not like me but he knows I'll pay him back with interest, and if I can't my kids and grandkids will.
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Old 10-07-2011, 08:05 PM  
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Originally Posted by oldognewtrick View Post
Rival, I agree with you, a lot of the working class deserve to make more.

Our problem is not a revenue problem at the federal level, we have a spending problem. Do you have a budget at your house (our govt doesn't)? Or do you spend twice your yearly income thinking, well if I spend more all the problems will be solved. I'll just borrow another 200 grand from blucher, he may not like me but he knows I'll pay him back with interest, and if I can't my kids and grandkids will.
The problem is that the bottom 50% of the US population controls just 2.5% of the wealth, causing all sorts of economic problems. What's the solution to that?


The last time we saw this level of divergence in income disparity was in the 1920s. In the 1930s and 1940s, we saw a convergence. Income disparity was fairly stable in the 1950s and 1960s, before skyrocketing in the 1970s through today.
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Old 10-07-2011, 08:31 PM  
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The last time we saw this level of divergence in income disparity was in the 1920s. In the 1930s and 1940s, we saw a convergence. Income disparity was fairly stable in the 1950s and 1960s, before skyrocketing in the 1970s through today.
Before the mortgage mess a house was expensive but most good workers could manage a mortgage. Today crap house cost more than I'd ever pay for any investment.

Wall Street and Big Money in general went on a spree during which nothing was produced except convoluted new banking instruments few understood or cared to understand. After all, they were making money.

I had no part in any of it because from early on there were people saying it was unsustainable and would all fall apart. If I knew that those involved knew far more but cared only for the profit.

People should bust Bernie out of jail and film him being given to the folks who lost their life savings.Film whatever is left of him afterwards. Play the film every day at odd intervals.
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Old 10-07-2011, 08:39 PM  
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Originally Posted by oldognewtrick View Post
Rival, I agree with you, a lot of the working class deserve to make more.

Our problem is not a revenue problem at the federal level, we have a spending problem. Do you have a budget at your house (our govt doesn't)? Or do you spend twice your yearly income thinking, well if I spend more all the problems will be solved. I'll just borrow another 200 grand from blucher, he may not like me but he knows I'll pay him back with interest, and if I can't my kids and grandkids will.
that is trivializing the real issue, the rich do benefit from this country, we DON'T have a spending issue (yes there is waste) but look at the tax rates of other developed countries, the rich have it among the EASIEST here, if we were even above average you would have a point, but we aren't, the real fact of the matter is a country is expensive to run, there are many third world countries with lower tax rates, but I don't see Americans wanting to move there.....

the real issue is that the rich want all these tax breaks and the lowest tax rates and subsidies and breaks for their companies and then want the working poor to pay for it.
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Old 10-08-2011, 11:47 AM  
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Why all of a sudden is everyone freaking out on Wall Street? This didn't happen overnight. I still believe it's because the great ones' poll numbers are tanking. Why isn't someone protesting about the money 500 million given to the solar company that disappeared and was set to get...wait for it...another almost 500 million? Wall Street, what about Pennsylvania Ave?
Occupy Wall Street is an independent group almost no one noticed it's first two weeks. It has Ron Paul nuts, anarchists and a bit of everything.
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Old 10-08-2011, 01:13 PM  
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The top 1% control 43% of the national wealth, yet pay only 38.02% of total income taxes.

The top 5% control 62% of the wealth, but pay only 58.72% of total income taxes.

The top 10% control 73% of the wealth, but pay only 69.94% of total income taxes

The top 25% control 87% of the wealth, and pay 86.34% of total income taxes. Here, between the 75th and 90th percentiles, we see the numbers begin to balance back out. There is a line, somewhere between the 50th percentile and the 75th percentile, where everyone above that line is stealing from everyone below that line.
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