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Old 11-10-2010, 08:34 AM  
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Fort Wayne, Indiana
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Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
OUCH! And I actually voted for Obama.
I'm sorry!!
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Old 11-10-2010, 09:53 AM  
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Knoxville, TN
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Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
OUCH! And I actually voted for Obama.
I hope you got your money's worth, I mean vote's worth.

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Old 11-10-2010, 10:49 PM  
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Mesa, Az
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Originally Posted by jacko View Post
I hope you got your money's worth, I mean vote's worth.
Let me put it this way: I was leaning towards McCain (especially after Obama selected Biden) but; his choice of Palin scared me too much. Had he picked Romney, Guiliani, Rice or even Huckabee it would have been Obama who?
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Old 11-11-2010, 05:02 AM  
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Fort Wayne, Indiana
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Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
Let me put it this way: I was leaning towards McCain (especially after Obama selected Biden) but; his choice of Palin scared me too much. Had he picked Romney, Guiliani, Rice or even Huckabee it would have been Obama who?
McCain was the biggest weenie in the entire Republican party, why the hell did the GOP elect him I'll never know. I swear it was almost like the GOP wanted the Obama to win.
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Old 11-11-2010, 08:17 AM  
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Kent, Ohio
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Hate to splash cold water on the side thread here, but...

Al Gore DID "create" the internet - in roughly the same way that Eisenhower (A president who fits the modern definition of "socialist", BTW) "created" the interstate highway. No, he didn't write programs, but even Vint Cerf and Bob Kahn (the "fathers" of the Internet (Yes, the internet has two daddies)) credit him as "the first elected official to grasp the potential of computer communications to have a broader impact than just improving the conduct of science and scholarship."

Quote:
As Vice President, Gore promoted building the Internet both up and out, as well as releasing the Internet from the control of the government agencies that spawned it. He served as the major administration proponent for continued investment in advanced computing and networking and private sector initiatives such as Net Day. He was and is a strong proponent of extending access to the network to schools and libraries. Today, approximately 95% of our nation's schools are on the Internet. Gore provided much-needed political support for the speedy privatization of the Internet when the time arrived for it to become a commercially-driven operation.
<nettime> Al Gore and the Internet

So yeah, rag on him for self-service during Wolf Blitzer's interview on 9 March 1999. But don't rag on him for the validity of the statement - it's very true.

Incidentally, If you'd care to contrast the government-originated Internet with earlier information systems developed by competitive forces, try to access the Multiple Listing Service from your local board of Realtors. These systems were created long before the internet. They used to utilize periodic directory listings and ticker tape updates. Today, MLS systems are a hodgepodge of expensive and feature-poor, regional databases, created to serve the needs of businesses. There is, effectively, zero competition in these services in most areas, no access for anyone but a real estate professional. The key failure in the MLS system is the centralized control - the local Board of Realtors claims responsibility for everything on the system, fining any agent or brokerage that violates stated policies, and ensuring that there is zero innovation. These systems lag behind virtually every other database system in the world, to the point that publicly available systems are rapidly subsuming the few capabilities the MLS provides.

There are thousands of similar information systems spawned by nearsighted, profit driven corporations, any one of which could have easily been developed into a functional, multi-purpose information network. There were plenty of corporations that had a vested interest in doing so. (News agencies, telecom companies, etc. Reuters comes to mind as one of the more successful, but significantly limited ventures.) They generally refused, because such systems require a generally cooperative attitude, while business tolerates cooperation only to the extent that it serves their own interests.



This has been an update from Citizens for Sanity. We now return you to your regularly scheduled program, "Dem-Bashing" by Tea Party, Inc.
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Old 11-11-2010, 10:18 AM  
southern conservative

Austin, Texas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian View Post
What are you guys laughing at? Choosing Biden as VP was the best decision Obama has made. Every other decision Obama has made has been far worse.
You are right, I guess it's not funny.
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Old 11-11-2010, 10:42 AM  
southern conservative

Austin, Texas
Join Date: Sep 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rivalarrival View Post
Hate to splash cold water on the side thread here, but...

Al Gore DID "create" the internet - in roughly the same way that Eisenhower (A president who fits the modern definition of "socialist", BTW) "created" the interstate highway. No, he didn't write programs, but even Vint Cerf and Bob Kahn (the "fathers" of the Internet (Yes, the internet has two daddies)) credit him as "the first elected official to grasp the potential of computer communications to have a broader impact than just improving the conduct of science and scholarship."



<nettime> Al Gore and the Internet

So yeah, rag on him for self-service during Wolf Blitzer's interview on 9 March 1999. But don't rag on him for the validity of the statement - it's very true.

Incidentally, If you'd care to contrast the government-originated Internet with earlier information systems developed by competitive forces, try to access the Multiple Listing Service from your local board of Realtors. These systems were created long before the internet. They used to utilize periodic directory listings and ticker tape updates. Today, MLS systems are a hodgepodge of expensive and feature-poor, regional databases, created to serve the needs of businesses. There is, effectively, zero competition in these services in most areas, no access for anyone but a real estate professional. The key failure in the MLS system is the centralized control - the local Board of Realtors claims responsibility for everything on the system, fining any agent or brokerage that violates stated policies, and ensuring that there is zero innovation. These systems lag behind virtually every other database system in the world, to the point that publicly available systems are rapidly subsuming the few capabilities the MLS provides.

There are thousands of similar information systems spawned by nearsighted, profit driven corporations, any one of which could have easily been developed into a functional, multi-purpose information network. There were plenty of corporations that had a vested interest in doing so. (News agencies, telecom companies, etc. Reuters comes to mind as one of the more successful, but significantly limited ventures.) They generally refused, because such systems require a generally cooperative attitude, while business tolerates cooperation only to the extent that it serves their own interests.



This has been an update from Citizens for Sanity. We now return you to your regularly scheduled program, "Dem-Bashing" by Tea Party, Inc.
See, the problem with this I invented the internet thing is the "I invented" part. He DID NOT invent it. He might have saw a better or bigger use for it, but he sure as hell did NOT invent it. You might full some of us all the time, but you can't fool all of us all the time. You can say what you want, but it doesn't change the facts. AL Gore is a dork and that's why he didn't and couldn't win.
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Old 11-12-2010, 08:28 AM  
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Kent, Ohio
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Originally Posted by 78BO View Post
See, the problem with this I invented the internet thing is the "I invented" part. He DID NOT invent it. He might have saw a better or bigger use for it, but he sure as hell did NOT invent it. You might full some of us all the time, but you can't fool all of us all the time. You can say what you want, but it doesn't change the facts. AL Gore is a dork and that's why he didn't and couldn't win.
Maybe on Saturday night live or something he claimed to have invented the internet. As a joke. He never seriously claimed to have invented the internet, he claimed to have CREATED it, in the same manner as any politician would "create" anything - by passing legislation supporting it.
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Old 11-12-2010, 10:37 AM  
southern conservative

Austin, Texas
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Originally Posted by rivalarrival View Post
Maybe on Saturday night live or something he claimed to have invented the internet. As a joke. He never seriously claimed to have invented the internet, he claimed to have CREATED it, in the same manner as any politician would "create" anything - by passing legislation supporting it.
Sorry, no you are wrong. I hate directly saying that but I can't help it. I'm not wanting to start a internet fight or anything but that's just not true.

Sen. Jerry Patterson CREATED the concealed handgun law. He didn't make the gun, or the concealment of a gun, but he did create the law that lets us carry a concealed handgun. He wrote the law. That he can take credit for.


I assume you have read the link that you posted? Now we all know that anyone can create fake pages on the net, so I'm not even sure who posted or typed that. But the first paragraph tells the whole story. These two people are Gore supporters from the word go. And they don't prove anything.

"No one person or even small group of persons exclusively "invented" the
Internet.
It is the result of many years of ongoing collaboration among
people in government and the university community. But as the two people
who designed the basic architecture and the core protocols that make the
Internet work, we would like to acknowledge VP Gore's contributions as a
Congressman, Senator and as Vice President. No other elected official, to
our knowledge
, has made a greater contribution over a longer period of
time."


What that says is that Gore was one of many people in congress that saw this idea as a good idea. In their eyes Gore MIGHT have done more, again MIGHT have. "to our knowledge".

Do you see the difference between someone CREATING something and someone backing something?

Did Gore misspoke? Sure he did. Did he mean to imply that he make the internet? NO. But that's how it came out and that's just another reason why people didn't vote for him.
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Old 11-12-2010, 01:36 PM  
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Kent, Ohio
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 1,237 | Kudos: +67
Quote:
Originally Posted by 78BO View Post
Sorry, no you are wrong. I hate directly saying that but I can't help it. I'm not wanting to start a internet fight or anything but that's just not true.

Sen. Jerry Patterson CREATED the concealed handgun law. He didn't make the gun, or the concealment of a gun, but he did create the law that lets us carry a concealed handgun. He wrote the law. That he can take credit for.


I assume you have read the link that you posted? Now we all know that anyone can create fake pages on the net, so I'm not even sure who posted or typed that. But the first paragraph tells the whole story. These two people are Gore supporters from the word go. And they don't prove anything.

"No one person or even small group of persons exclusively "invented" the
Internet.
It is the result of many years of ongoing collaboration among
people in government and the university community. But as the two people
who designed the basic architecture and the core protocols that make the
Internet work, we would like to acknowledge VP Gore's contributions as a
Congressman, Senator and as Vice President. No other elected official, to
our knowledge
, has made a greater contribution over a longer period of
time."


What that says is that Gore was one of many people in congress that saw this idea as a good idea. In their eyes Gore MIGHT have done more, again MIGHT have. "to our knowledge".

Do you see the difference between someone CREATING something and someone backing something?



Did Gore misspoke? Sure he did. Did he mean to imply that he make the internet? NO. But that's how it came out and that's just another reason why people didn't vote for him.
Weaseling out of it by implying there was some other elected official with a greater claim? That's what you're going to go with?

Vinton Cerf and Bob Kahn aren't some random Al Gore fanboys. They were the architects, the designers of the protocols, the foundation upon which the entire internet operates. They would be in the best position to say who did and did not have a hand in its creation, and they spoke highly of Gore's efforts. If asked to choose between the mountain of public criticism about Gore's involvement, or the statements of either of these two men, I've got to go with them. Yeah, they are Gore supporters "from the word go". That word being given AFTER Gore demonstrated his support and earned their respect.

The protocols credited to Cerf and Kahn can be (and are) used in non-internet networks around the world - virtually ALL modern computer networks utilize IP (as in "TCP/IP") at the transport level of the protocol stack. The key difference between the internet and any other form of IP network is the public policy governing it. His efforts to create that policy give Gore a legitimate claim to be one of the key people responsible for the internet. He did "create" it, in as much a sense as any elected official can "create" anything.

And yes, everything I said is the truth. He claimed to have CREATED the internet on CNN in an interview with Wolf Blitzer, 9-March-1999. I have never seen anything where he seriously claimed to have INVENTED the internet. I know he was on SNL, and parodied his own statements, but I've never seen him seriously claim to have invented it. If you're going to say I'm wrong, prove it. If he made the claim some other time, I don't know about it.
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