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Old 09-30-2011, 07:11 PM  
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Originally Posted by DougLeary View Post
It's precisely because there are different levels of creationism that I take issue with statements like, "Einstein believed in creationism" or "Einstein believed in intelligent design." In most people's minds the words "creationism" and "intelligent design" both refer to the world and everything in it being created by God in finished form. Einstein regarded this as nonsense, and explicitly said so on many occasions. Claiming that he believed in either creationism or intelligent design, without explaining that you mean some specific non-standard interpretation of those words is deceptive, and I think you probably know that. Lies of omission are lies, no matter how politely they are expressed.
And some believe in evolution and want others to believe in it as well.
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Old 09-30-2011, 07:52 PM  
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And some believe in evolution and want others to believe in it as well.
it's an acknowledgement of science and not a belief, but nice try.
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Old 09-30-2011, 07:59 PM  
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An acknowledgment of a scientific THEORY is what I'm sure you meant to say.

Einstein openly acknowledged that it was absurd to think all the complexities of life happened purely by chance. If you disagree that's the belief in intelligent design, what would you classify that as?
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Old 09-30-2011, 11:44 PM  
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I'll be the first to admit that both are scientific theories, or hypotheses to which predictions can be made. In fact I was an evolutionist until I realized that the only reason I believed in it was that most engineers and scientists around me believed in it (somehow thinking someone else had proven it). At first I began to question them just to prod them, then realizing that they had no answers I began the move to the creationist side. I found that NASA astronomers, for example, never questioned the biology assumptions of origins they just built on them thus building the house of cards that many believe to be science.
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Old 10-01-2011, 02:14 AM  
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Originally Posted by Jake7 View Post
An acknowledgment of a scientific THEORY is what I'm sure you meant to say.

Einstein openly acknowledged that it was absurd to think all the complexities of life happened purely by chance. If you disagree that's the belief in intelligent design, what would you classify that as?
I would classify it as some guy on the internet interpreting Einstein from a narrow point of view.

One famous quote, "God does not play dice with the universe," is often cited as a belief in intelligent design, but it was actually a specific reference to quantum theory, whose reliance on the notion of unpredictability offended Einstein's deep love of the order of the universe.


Einstein said a lot of seemingly contradictory things about God and religion. A few examples:

"It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly."

"I want to know how God created this world. I am not interested in this or that phenomenon, in the spectrum of this or that element. I want to know his thoughts. The rest are details."

"To sense that behind anything that can be experienced there is something that our minds cannot grasp, whose beauty and sublimity reaches us only indirectly: this is religiousness. In this sense, and in this sense only, I am a devoutly religious man."

"It is very difficult to elucidate this [cosmic religious] feeling to anyone who is entirely without it. . . The religious geniuses of all ages have been distinguished by this kind of religious feeling, which knows no dogma and no God conceived in man's image; so that there can be no church whose central teachings are based on it ... In my view, it is the most important function of art and science to awaken this feeling and keep it alive in those who are receptive to it."

"I have repeatedly said that in my opinion the idea of a personal God is a childlike one, but I do not share the crusading spirit of the professional atheist whose fervor is mostly due to a painful act of liberation from the fetters of religious indoctrination received in youth. I prefer an attitude of humility corresponding to the weakness of our intellectual understanding of nature and of our own being."

Many people interviewed Einstein about his religious beliefs, as if they expected him to issue a definitive statement about the meaning of life or whether God existed. People still quote carefully selected bits and pieces of his writings in an attempt to justify their own beliefs. Einstein was a scientist and human being with his own personal beliefs. His concept of godliness seems to me to be embodied in the laws and order of nature, not as a separate being but as nature itself. But that's just my interpretation. I think it's wrong (and pointless) to try to use him as a mascot for any particular mythos.
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Old 10-01-2011, 09:28 AM  
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Hah another evolution thread, really? Did you know Albert Einstein believed in creationism? Eek! Must've been a psycho, right?!
Afraid not Jake. Einstein believed the initial Big Bang might have been the work of an entity but he believe since that event evolution accounted for everything since.

Since the man is dead the flat earthers may be spreading that lie but it's as bogus asas the rest of their "facts".
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Old 10-01-2011, 08:28 PM  
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Which leads me to my favorite Einstein quote:

"In view of such harmony in the cosmos which I, with my limited human mind, am able to recognize, there are yet people who say there is no God. But what really makes me angry is that they quote me for the support of such views."

Additionally I enjoy your "flat-earthers" label, both in that it's complete irrelevance to this topic as well as due to the constant polling of Americans, most recently in 2010, that points to the majority believing that God, in some way, was involved in the creation of mankind.

God created man pretty much in his present form at one time within the last 10,000 years. - 40%

Man has developed over millions of years from less advanced forms of life, but God guided this process, including man's creation. - 30%

Man has developed over millions of years from less advanced forms of life. God had no part in this process. - 16%

That, of course, evenly averaged out different education levels. The poll, along with other polls from previous years, are listed here:

Beliefs of the U.S. public about evolution and creation


So, if I may, the "round-earthers" are far and wide in the minority.
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Old 10-02-2011, 02:23 PM  
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So, if I may, the "round-earthers" are far and wide in the minority.
Sure are and you can go to any teabuggery meeting and experience their ignorance for yourself. The cannot spell, their leaders haven't a clue about History (or much else) and they're stereotypical Ammurricans. I'm ashamed of them.
They completely lack any signs of intellectual curiosity and they get their "facts" from Beck & Televangelism.

You said you're educated so just keep reading.
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Old 10-02-2011, 02:40 PM  
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The cannot spell........
Hmmm?
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Old 10-02-2011, 03:49 PM  
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Originally Posted by blucher

Sure are and you can go to any teabuggery meeting and experience their ignorance for yourself. The cannot spell, their leaders haven't a clue about History (or much else) and they're stereotypical Ammurricans. I'm ashamed of them.
They completely lack any signs of intellectual curiosity and they get their "facts" from Beck & Televangelism.

You said you're educated so just keep reading.
What does the tea party have to do with this?

Don't get so ruffled. It's just a friendly discussion.
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