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Old 08-14-2011, 11:23 PM  
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Originally Posted by ImJustAvg View Post
Yes, we could just draft like all the other countries do! If we drafted EVERY people from the age of 19-23 with NO exemptions then we could have a cheaper army, because we would already have a force that could be called up quickly because everyone would have military experience and be able to be called back to duty for the next thirty years!

That way we wouldn't need such a large standing army! Israel, Switzerland, Russia, Ukraine, etc all do this, and that way they have a smaller standing army but can quickly mobilize a much larger army!

Do you think ALL of our 19-23 year olds would like to have to put off college or their lives to be able to cut defense spending but still having the military capability that we need? And that does include women and men, since we have equal rights!
yeah, there were no other options there..........

the problem is we DON'T need the military we have, it's not a payment of soldiers issue, we are still buying every new toy a defense contractor comes out with like it's the cold war and we have bases all over the world.... we CAN afford to scale back and if we quit interfering worldwide we won't be so much of a target of people that hate us for interfering.
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Old 08-15-2011, 08:31 AM  
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Colorado Springs, CO
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Originally Posted by Musicinabottle View Post
Oh please. Just how many trillions do we need to spend to keep AK toting extremists in the poorest country on the face of the planet in line?
And how did those extremists do on 9/11? Think Guy! For each terrorists out there, it takes hundreds of defenders to catch and stop them! It is easier to fight an army than an extremist! In an army to army fight it is all about tactics and who has the most effective firepower. With an extremist, first you have to detect them, then find them, then stop them

When they start attacking us again, how many men will it take to effectively defend your cities water supply? Or the telephone systems? Or the electricity? The gas pipe lines? And so many other things that make up the infrastructure of the USA.

Or do you want to drink poisoned or radioactive water? Go without communicating other than walking across the street to talk to someone. With such a society as ours, once a terrorist is across the border, it is easy for them to get to most any objective they have. And we all know how secure our borders are, don't we?
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Old 08-15-2011, 08:54 AM  
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Colorado Springs, CO
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Originally Posted by Musicinabottle View Post
Forget the draft, though it is actually a great idea, but how about just staying out of needless wars? The country is on its back with flies circling and we continue to spend spend spend like it's Christmas or something on the war machine! Let's put the money to use on more important issues like Medicare and social security. Forget saving the world, let's start out with saving America!
I agree that our elected officials need to spend the tax dollars wisely and I am all for the balanced budget, but you also have to have a balanced society. Extremists will always want to attack and forcibly change things that are different from what they believe.

Right now, we fight them in their own countries and do our best to keep them out of the USA, but as we scale back the military, they will come to our country! The question is not whether they will or not, the question is when? And then the same people that feel secure today and demand a smaller military, will be screaming that the military that is left do something! And there will be another military buildup, until things get secure again, and then people will once again demand a decrease in the size of the military. It has been like that since George Washington and it will always be like that because people want a secure life but they don't want to pay for it. They don't want to give up any rights!

Right now, military people are serving more time outside of the USA on deployments than they do at home with their families. They are risking their lives on a daily basis so that people at home are a little safer. And when we hear our elected officials and the general population wanting to freeze what little pay we get or even decrease it, we feel very unappreciated!

When the first desert war started, we didn't have enough body armor for everyone, or enough of the right types of armored vehicles and that would have cost us dearly if the Air Force hadn't been so effective. Was the shortage problems corrected? No, when the second one started - we were still short of the same things and this time we have sent way to many people home in body bags! If more of our elected officials had served, they would understand what it is like on the battlefield and hostile environments and spend the defense dollars wiser.

For those of you that think the military is overpaid, most of you pay more in taxs than the average military person makes and you aren't asked to kiss your family and go away for a long time and get shot at. Our lowest three grades are eligible for food stamps if they have even one child. Is that overpaid?
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Old 08-15-2011, 09:52 AM  
mohel
 
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Keizer, OR
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This election is going to be the providers vs the takers.
More like the GREEDY vs the NEEDY
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Old 08-15-2011, 10:37 AM  
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Colorado Springs, CO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedJeepXJ View Post
yeah, there were no other options there..........

the problem is we DON'T need the military we have, it's not a payment of soldiers issue, we are still buying every new toy a defense contractor comes out with like it's the cold war and we have bases all over the world.... we CAN afford to scale back and if we quit interfering worldwide we won't be so much of a target of people that hate us for interfering.
Take off your rose colored glasses! We have been invaded by all the illegals that come here because of their perception of a better life and then find out that their dreams of a better life was just dreams. So they turn to crime and then our prisons fill up and we have to use our tax dollars to support them. They constantly want to build new prisons to house more and more of them!

Our border patrol is outnumbered and out gunned and don't have complete support of the government or the people!

Do you think the Muslim extremists are going to have a hard time getting into the US? When 9/11 happened the military was down sizing, closing bases in the USA and overseas, and we still were attacked here on our homeland! It will happen again and not too far in the future, unless we are ready for it.

Think of the military like an insurance policy. If the world bully knows he is going to get a butt kicking if he throws the first punch, he will at least think twice before throwing it.
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Old 08-15-2011, 11:29 AM  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ImJustAvg View Post
And how did those extremists do on 9/11? Think Guy! For each terrorists out there, it takes hundreds of defenders to catch and stop them! It is easier to fight an army than an extremist! In an army to army fight it is all about tactics and who has the most effective firepower. With an extremist, first you have to detect them, then find them, then stop them

When they start attacking us again, how many men will it take to effectively defend your cities water supply? Or the telephone systems? Or the electricity? The gas pipe lines? And so many other things that make up the infrastructure of the USA.

Or do you want to drink poisoned or radioactive water? Go without communicating other than walking across the street to talk to someone. With such a society as ours, once a terrorist is across the border, it is easy for them to get to most any objective they have. And we all know how secure our borders are, don't we?
You're being too simplic. The attacks of 911 were a matter of intelligence or should I say a lack thereof? In Iraq, we had individual men who would use IEDs or an AK 47 to attack people over there, then drop into a crowd of people dressed the same. YOU CANNOT FIGHT THIS SORT OF THNG! Much lkike you cannot fight gun violence in our own country! Big fancy planes and tanks don't stop the terrorists, intelligence does, when it's a matter of defending our own country. Bushes motto of "If we ain't fightin' em over there" nonesence was ignorance to the core. Look, I'm patriotic as the next guy, heck I even served in the Navy, but excess is excess, and in my opinion, we need to be saving our own country rather than tracking terrorists in the form of a war, then calling it a freedom assignment. The military learned a great deal about the tanacity of the robe wearing gun toting rebels over there in Iraq and however you spell the name of that other country we're in.
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Old 08-15-2011, 11:31 AM  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedJeepXJ View Post
yeah, there were no other options there..........

the problem is we DON'T need the military we have, it's not a payment of soldiers issue, we are still buying every new toy a defense contractor comes out with like it's the cold war and we have bases all over the world.... we CAN afford to scale back and if we quit interfering worldwide we won't be so much of a target of people that hate us for interfering.
Very well stated RJ. If only healthcare and social security recieved the loving attention and funds that the military got! What a perfect world huh?
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Old 08-15-2011, 11:41 AM  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ImJustAvg View Post
I agree that our elected officials need to spend the tax dollars wisely and I am all for the balanced budget, but you also have to have a balanced society. Extremists will always want to attack and forcibly change things that are different from what they believe.

Right now, we fight them in their own countries and do our best to keep them out of the USA, but as we scale back the military, they will come to our country! The question is not whether they will or not, the question is when? And then the same people that feel secure today and demand a smaller military, will be screaming that the military that is left do something! And there will be another military buildup, until things get secure again, and then people will once again demand a decrease in the size of the military. It has been like that since George Washington and it will always be like that because people want a secure life but they don't want to pay for it. They don't want to give up any rights!

Right now, military people are serving more time outside of the USA on deployments than they do at home with their families. They are risking their lives on a daily basis so that people at home are a little safer. And when we hear our elected officials and the general population wanting to freeze what little pay we get or even decrease it, we feel very unappreciated!

When the first desert war started, we didn't have enough body armor for everyone, or enough of the right types of armored vehicles and that would have cost us dearly if the Air Force hadn't been so effective. Was the shortage problems corrected? No, when the second one started - we were still short of the same things and this time we have sent way to many people home in body bags! If more of our elected officials had served, they would understand what it is like on the battlefield and hostile environments and spend the defense dollars wiser.

For those of you that think the military is overpaid, most of you pay more in taxs than the average military person makes and you aren't asked to kiss your family and go away for a long time and get shot at. Our lowest three grades are eligible for food stamps if they have even one child. Is that overpaid?
Well, it's a pretty well known fact that the first gulf war certainly didn't need to happen as well as the second. So, this, if played differently could have saved us a few trillion dollars, but NO! let's go after school teachers and firefighters as well as the poor grandmas medicare in our own country, instead.
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Old 08-15-2011, 02:05 PM  
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Colorado Springs, CO
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Originally Posted by Musicinabottle View Post
Well, it's a pretty well known fact that the first gulf war certainly didn't need to happen as well as the second. So, this, if played differently could have saved us a few trillion dollars, but NO! let's go after school teachers and firefighters as well as the poor grandmas medicare in our own country, instead.
The first gulf war was not needed? What have you been smoking? Do you think Saddam would have given Kuwait back without it?

I hope you are back in college learning middle eastern languages!
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Old 08-15-2011, 02:42 PM  
mohel
 
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Keizer, OR
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The first gulf war was not needed? What have you been smoking? Do you think Saddam would have given Kuwait back without it?
who elected us the protectors of Kuwait? It was our ambassador who mis-spoke allowing old looney tunes to think he had our blessing. Saudi Arabia and Iran could have addressed the problem.

Neither the 2nd Iraq war nor Afghanistan did more than us shipping targets to the terrorist's backyard.
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