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Old 06-11-2011, 11:27 PM  
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Originally Posted by blucher View Post

My personal belief is that these instructions are very useful in our own lives and reflects Christ's teachings

Blucher, If you really feel this way why do you spend so much time and effort trying to discredit His teaching? Hummmmm?


it strains my credulity to think this latest slant on Christianity isn't just so much malarkey.

Blucher, My post is not just the latest slant on Christianity. It is and always has been the heart of Christianity. There is no other. If they are so useful as you say why do you now call them so much "malarkey?'

My whole point on religions is that yours or anyone's is fine by me until practitioners wish to push it on me.
You don't have to worry about having Christianity pushed on you. Christianity only has value if one desires to follow it. It is not like the Islamic faith where they force it on others at the point of a sword. So you are quite safe in that respect.


Quote:
Originally Posted by RedJeepXJ View Post
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

wow, using circular arguments to make a point, the bible is valid because the bible says it is....... come on, please debate at a higher level then that.....

any religion is going to have similar demands/statements, posting what you did proves nothing and not relevant to any discussion of religion that has any substance, it is but a distraction from logic....
Redjeep, apparently you did not read my post very closely or your poisoned mind doesn't grasp the truth in what is being said. Salvation is the Gift of God, it doesn't depend upon "demands" of God being met by your compliance to "demands."

Also, Redjeep, we are not discussing "Logic." Christianity relies on faith of the believer. It has nothing to do with a discussion of logic. Your logic is a distraction of the benefits of the Gospel.


Quote:
Originally Posted by blucher View Post
early in the country's History the Massachusetts Bay Colony had the most clout in the colonies. This was Puritan drivel that still haunts us.

Next came the new age of America as a world class contender and that brought waves of nationalistic fervor and home grown American religions like the Mormons. Today the religious power base wants a form of Baptist Sharia in a Theocracy

Blucher, Would you mind telling us how that "Puritan drivel" still haunts us? I'm tired of you making many negative statements and then running from them. Back up your thoughts with some truthful facts.

My point being state & religion have been tried over and over and always results in persecution usually of the minority.

This world will not live under a Theocracy until Christ's millineal reign, and it will be far from persecution.

Only the most short sighted should see that what you do today may haunt your tomorrows.
Those are the truest words you have ever spoken. If you refuse to except the gift of God and reject His plan of salvation, you most definitely will regret it on Judgment day. A regret that will follow you throughout eternity.
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Old 06-12-2011, 01:05 AM  
mohel
 
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"You don't have to worry about having Christianity pushed on you. Christianity only has value if one desires to follow it. It is not like the Islamic faith where they force it on others at the point of a sword. So you are quite safe in that respect."

I didn't mean being forced to be a Christian but rather that some Christians seem to think it's America's state religion.

Malarkey is raptures and even thinking a creation myth is in any way Scientific and deserves a place in education. I have no tolerance for ignorance that would sacrifice education for the myth of any literal bible.

I had and appreciated my extensive religious education. Thomistic Logic is still pretty good stuff if you squint a bit. During all those years and until say the last 10 years I never cared who practiced what. Yesterday two very nice Jehovah Witness ladies dropped by for a chat and we all got along great.
They really seemed to understand I've chosen my own personal relationship with God and if others find that in a church then all the better.

I only want it out of government and out of education. If someone is that intent on teaching their kids creation myths do it in your home or your church.
A Baptist Theocracy is no better than an Islamaniac Theocracy. Church and state don't mix without evil resulting.

As to your position on Christianity not changing I disagree. There are more versions of Christianity than I could count. Even the Mormons say they're Christian.

Last night on TV a woman on her death bed asks for a bible and is handed one. One glance and she says, "no, not that one, The King James version..........."

My point is you can't have literal bibles when all manner of people have been rewriting the thing for 2000 years. Is the King James version a reformation bible or part of Henry the 8th's grand design for a new religion?

Which books were left out of the bible, by who, (or is it whom?) and why?

In doing my research on tele-evangelists I read some interesting material from some more believable Christians. They contend that much of TBN is a repackaged "how to get rich quick" book with the dual intent of enriching the flock to increase the tithes. Not very nice people at all but no one is riding these bums outta town on a rail.

I believe that if you're a good peace loving Muslim you should be irate as hell at the crazies who give Islam a bad name....but I don't hear it. The same holds true for pedo priests and televangelists....but I don't hear it.
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Old 06-12-2011, 01:59 PM  
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Mill Creek, Washington
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Quote:
Malarkey is raptures and even thinking a creation myth is in any way Scientific and deserves a place in education. I have no tolerance for ignorance that would sacrifice education for the myth of any literal bible.

Sorry that the facts of God's Word is malarkey to you. But one day you will know the truth of what they contend.

Quote:
I had and appreciated my extensive religious education. Thomistic Logic is still pretty good stuff if you squint a bit.

Would you kindly explain what that extensive religious education was? And what is "Thomistic Logic"?

Quote:
As to your position on Christianity not changing I disagree. There are more versions of Christianity than I could count.

I disagree with your contention; Christianity is to be a associate of Christ as spelled out in His Word. Any thing else is a cult imitator.

Quote:
My point is you can't have literal bibles when all manner of people have been rewriting the thing for 2000 years.

That is a wrong assumption that is not born out in the facts. Archeologist have recovered original manuscripts and have done comparisons and have found that modern day translations are very faithful.

Quote:
Which books were left out of the bible, by who, (or is it whom?) and why?

What makes you think that anything has been left out? All the messages of the Bible have very satisfactory conclusions. There are no hanging threads.

Quote:
In doing my research on tele-evangelists I read some interesting material from some more believable Christians. They contend that much of TBN is a repackaged "how to get rich quick" book with the dual intent of enriching the flock to increase the tithes. Not very nice people at all but no one is riding these bums outta town on a rail.

This may surprise you but here I am going to agree with you. I am the published author of the book: "Subtle Deception," How False Teachers Betray Christianity While Enriching Themselves." And is available at Amazon on the net.
In there I come down hard on such false prophets such as Paul and Jan Crouch, also the "Prosperity Doctrine."


Quote:
I believe that if you're a good peace loving Muslim you should be irate as hell at the crazies who give Islam a bad name....but I don't hear it. The same holds true for pedo priests and televangelists....but I don't hear it.

Your not looking in the right places. Try my book!
Forgive me for that shameful plug!
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Old 06-12-2011, 02:26 PM  
mohel
 
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Quote:
Blucher, Would you mind telling us how that "Puritan drivel" still haunts us? I'm tired of you making many negative statements and then running from them. Back up your thoughts with some truthful facts.
IN PA I could not sell school supplies to kids on Sunday. That state's Blue Laws persisted well into the 90's. There are similar laws in other states.

Most of Western Culture has a far more relaxed view of sexuality and derive a great deal of humor watching this country still wrestle with it. Late night comics use puritanical responses as fodder for jokes BECAUSE they're FUNNY.

We recently had a member ranting about SODOMITES. I'm surprised Clinton wasn't charged with sodomy too. In a few states it may still be possible.

The only reason Carter caught flak for "lusting in his heart" was because good Christian folk with those same lusty thoughts judged him rather than themselves.

Gays don't threaten marriage but closed mindedness and getting married at 16 because of a pregnancy sure do. The news says that for the first time fewer couples living together are married rather than unmarried.
I sincerely believe having open & frank conversations with kids about sex leads to better relationships and marriages. It lessens unplanned pregnancies and demystifies a gift from God.
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Old 06-12-2011, 02:43 PM  
mohel
 
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Quote:
Quote:
Malarkey is raptures and even thinking a creation myth is in any way Scientific and deserves a place in education. I have no tolerance for ignorance that would sacrifice education for the myth of any literal bible.

Sorry that the facts of God's Word is malarkey to you. But one day you will know the truth of what they contend.

Yeah, the dinosaurs had to ride in the back of the ark so no one tripped over their tails.

Quote:
I had and appreciated my extensive religious education. Thomistic Logic is still pretty good stuff if you squint a bit.

Would you kindly explain what that extensive religious education was? And what is "Thomistic Logic"?

Catholicism from grade school through years at a Jesuit University. St. Thomas Aquinas was a student of logic and a good one. Along with mandatory theology classes we were obliged to study Thomistic Logic.

Quote:
As to your position on Christianity not changing I disagree. There are more versions of Christianity than I could count.

I disagree with your contention; Christianity is to be a associate of Christ as spelled out in His Word. Any thing else is a cult imitator.

That seems easy but which version of the bible hold his authentic words?

Quote:
My point is you can't have literal bibles when all manner of people have been rewriting the thing for 2000 years.

That is a wrong assumption that is not born out in the facts. Archeologist have recovered original manuscripts and have done comparisons and have found that modern day translations are very faithful.

The Kumran scrolls and other books were found by archaeologists who say these are often not included in the bible

Quote:
Which books were left out of the bible, by who, (or is it whom?) and why?

What makes you think that anything has been left out? All the messages of the Bible have very satisfactory conclusions. There are no hanging threads.

Sorry, there are many.

Quote:
In doing my research on tele-evangelists I read some interesting material from some more believable Christians. They contend that much of TBN is a repackaged "how to get rich quick" book with the dual intent of enriching the flock to increase the tithes. Not very nice people at all but no one is riding these bums outta town on a rail.

This may surprise you but here I am going to agree with you. I am the published author of the book: "Subtle Deception," How False Teachers Betray Christianity While Enriching Themselves." And is available at Amazon on the net.
In there I come down hard on such false prophets such as Paul and Jan Crouch, also the "Prosperity Doctrine."


While I disagree with you on some things your credibility factor just shot through the roof. I'd even buy your book if reading about them wasn't so upsetting to me. Thanks for telling me.

Quote:
I believe that if you're a good peace loving Muslim you should be irate as hell at the crazies who give Islam a bad name....but I don't hear it. The same holds true for pedo priests and televangelists....but I don't hear it.

Your not looking in the right places. Try my book!
Forgive me for that shameful plug!
On the contrary, I wish it were required reading for posting in this section!

Hillman sees like a fine man whose heart I can easily respect but he has this thing for red text. Could you try another color so I can tell one from the other more easily?
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Old 06-12-2011, 08:31 PM  
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Blucher, Just for you I will use blue! I just wanted to let you know that I enjoy your civil responses. And by the way where in Oregon is Keizer? I was raised up in Bend and Redmond. When I graduated I made a bee line for Seattle. 20 years there and 20 years in S. Florida and now back to Seattle. We couldn't stand the humidity and hurricanes in Florida.
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Old 06-12-2011, 09:04 PM  
mohel
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old-Goat View Post
Blucher, Just for you I will use blue! I just wanted to let you know that I enjoy your civil responses. And by the way where in Oregon is Keizer? I was raised up in Bend and Redmond. When I graduated I made a bee line for Seattle. 20 years there and 20 years in S. Florida and now back to Seattle. We couldn't stand the humidity and hurricanes in Florida.

I appreciate the blue Sir. Keizer is Salem's bedroom community (about 35,000 now) and lies just to the North. On my way to the Cascades I stopped to walk around Bend. It's a fine town and growing fast until the recession. What struck me most was my walk back to my truck. At an intersection I stopped to look around and let the cars figure out what they were doing. Then I realized nothing was moving. People in 4 directions were all sitting there politely waiting for me to decide which street to cross. I doffed my hat with a sweeping gesture of gratitude and knew for certain coming to Oregon was the best idea of my life.
On the East Cost that would simply NEVER happen.

Camping in the Gorge a doctor and his wife cautioned me about "hippies in Redmond". I haven't been much south of Eugene so I wouldn't know if there are any there but I'm a very old flower child so I think I could manage. <s>

Pop worked for AT&T and everyone took July vacations during shutdown. He had a free condo offer in FLA and we were going there in mid July.

It was my 2nd year trying to adjust to PA heat & humidity so I wished them well and stayed home to throw a party. You can't breath that crap. It's like trying to grow gills. I like my oxygen cool and crisp like MN & WI.

My best friend from High School teaches photography in Seattle so I'll be up that way if I can ever afford the gas. He thinks Oregon is all hillbillies but you and I know better. It might be nice if the women didn't all dress like loggers though.

Seattle was my initial destination in the NW dating from 30 years back. As realty prices rose I switched to Eugene and finally Keizer.

Ever go camping in the Olympic Peninsula? I'm looking for suggestions.
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Old 06-13-2011, 07:09 AM  
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Originally Posted by blucher View Post

[B]Hillman sees like a fine man whose heart I can easily respect but he has this thing for red text. [/B]


I guess being known for writing in red is better than nut'n.
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Old 06-13-2011, 08:17 AM  
ɹoʇɐɹǝpoɯ ɯnɹoɟ
 
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Isnt 'Red' synonymous with Communism?

Just sayin...
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Old 06-13-2011, 04:46 PM  
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Originally Posted by VaporLung View Post
Isnt 'Red' synonymous with Communism?

Just sayin...
VaporLung: Red is synonymous with the Cross.
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