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Old 09-01-2010, 08:01 PM  
southern conservative

Austin, Texas
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 133 | Kudos: +15
Saw this in a signature and thought WT!

"Undermining traditional religious morality and belief is THE KEY to making the new world order"

NOW I GET IT!

Saw this signature and just had to point out the flaw in it. Look at how this world has went to crap in the last 20 yrs. Kids get away with everything, parents no longer can discipline because they’re worried they go to jail. Kids lie and accuse parents of abuse because they got their cell phones taken away. Grown people that can’t take care of themselves, they feel the government should do that. There’s NO common sense, and no personal responsibility. We are in this recession because GROWN people couldn’t figure out that they couldn’t afford the house they were buying. People want to blame the banks, but the banks only did what the PEOPLE wanted them to do. Now they want the government to bail them out. People push religion out, all that does is open the door for the devil to do what he does best. And that’s get you to do things you shouldn’t. Religion helps teach all of these traits. The main one is loyalty! Loyalty to god, to family and to country.
So yes, undermine traditional religious morals if you love living in a world where people only care about themselves, and will cut your throat to save themselves. I will keep teaching my family about God and his teachings.
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Old 09-02-2010, 11:05 AM  
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Funetical's Avatar

Austin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 78BO View Post
"Undermining traditional religious morality and belief is THE KEY to making the new world order"
Saw this signature and just had to point out the flaw in it. Look at how this world has went to crap in the last 20 yrs. Kids get away with everything, parents no longer can discipline because they?re worried they go to jail. Kids lie and accuse parents of abuse because they got their cell phones taken away. Grown people that can?t take care of themselves, they feel the government should do that. There?s NO common sense, and no personal responsibility. We are in this recession because GROWN people couldn?t figure out that they couldn?t afford the house they were buying. People want to blame the banks, but the banks only did what the PEOPLE wanted them to do. Now they want the government to bail them out. People push religion out, all that does is open the door for the devil to do what he does best. And that?s get you to do things you shouldn?t. Religion helps teach all of these traits. The main one is loyalty! Loyalty to god, to family and to country.
So yes, undermine traditional religious morals if you love living in a world where people only care about themselves, and will cut your throat to save themselves. I will keep teaching my family about God and his teachings.
Well we're going to have to disagree on this one. Morality is taught by the society that uses it. Hence the constant transitioning of morality. The reason the banks did what they did, was out of greed, not to give people what they want. Banks make more money off late fees, than interest on a mortgage. It is beneficial for them, to have people to be able;e to barely pay their mortgage, but not to default. Because of there crap lending practices, due to the industrialization of credit, they over lent, and people defaulted, which puts the banks in the red. But instead of calling off the debt (which they could of done) they had the government call off theirs, another example of the plutocracy in which we reside.

What traditional values are you referring to? How to treat your slaves, how to beat your wife? All common practices just a few hundred years ago, sanctioned by the church, as whole. Hell they were burning witches up till a couple of hundred years ago. Morality is a function of society. It's how we learn and continue to better ourselves to the undefined goal which is life.
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Old 09-02-2010, 11:31 AM  
southern conservative

Austin, Texas
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 133 | Kudos: +15
Good points, but the problem is that we have grown past the past. We let the slave go because it was the right thing to do. We gave women rights because it AT THE TIME felt like the right thing to do (although I?m beginning to rethink that one). There was a time not to long ago when people did what was right because it was the right thing to do. The took responsibility for themselves. They worked hard, took care of their families, and did the right thing. Now days people don?t do the right thing. They look to blame their problems on other people. For example the black kid that got shot by the cop here in Austin. The parents blame the police. Yet they forget that the reason he was shot was because he was riding around town shooting a gun out the window. They also forget that just a week before he was arrested for armed robbery! This was not an innocent kid. This was a thug that was passed out in the back of a car with a gun on him. When the cop reached for it he woke and went to pull the gun on the cop. That?s what got him shot.
Same thing with Katrina. The federal, state, and local government told the people to leave town. They were on tv saying ?if you don?t leave you will die?. And what happened? People didn?t listen and they died. Now they want to blame the government.
I know this all might sound harsh, but if you really think about it you?ll have to agree. We as a people must take responsibility for our selves.

As for the mortgage crisis, I work in the mortgage industry. Have for 8 yrs, but I work for the state and only server Texas Veterans (another words we aren?t crooks). Banks, car salesman, recruiters, these are people that make money off of you. You should know that they are going to do things that are not always the right thing to do. But you as an individual know what you can and cannot afford. People decided to buy a houses that they couldn?t afford. The banks helped, but ultimately it falls on the buyer to decide if they should buy that home.
A guy is selling a truck that has a bad motor and smoking, but he promises that it?ll run for ever. Do you buy? And if so and the motor blows in the first day do you blame him?
The answer is no. You knew the motor had problems. Is the guy a jerk, sure. But in the end it?s the buyers responsibility.
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Old 09-02-2010, 03:11 PM  
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Austin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 78BO View Post
Good points, but the problem is that we have grown past the past. We let the slave go because it was the right thing to do. We gave women rights because it AT THE TIME felt like the right thing to do (although I?m beginning to rethink that one). There was a time not to long ago when people did what was right because it was the right thing to do.
But your saying morality in the absence of religion is non existent, but the morality of the Bible clearly details who to enslave, how to do it, and how to treat those slaves. We now know that slavery is immoral, hence the Bible is incorrect on this one.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 78BO View Post
The took responsibility for themselves. They worked hard, took care of their families, and did the right thing. Now days people don?t do the right thing. They look to blame their problems on other people.
When was this exactly? The people of Sodom and Gomorrah were clearly not those type, so I have to ask, when did we stop working and caring? We didn't it's always been this way. You want proof it's always been this way? Plato quoting Socrates""I mean such things as these: ? when the young are tobe silent before their elders; how they are to show respect to them by
standing and making them sit; what honour is due to parents; what
garments or shoes are to be worn; the mode of dressing the hair;
deportment and manners in general. You would agree with me? ? Yes."

To sum it up "Kids these days suck" That was 2000 years ago and you still hear it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by 78BO View Post
For example the black kid that got shot by the cop here in Austin. The parents blame the police. Yet they forget that the reason he was shot was because he was riding around town shooting a gun out the window. They also forget that just a week before he was arrested for armed robbery! This was not an innocent kid. This was a thug that was passed out in the back of a car with a gun on him. When the cop reached for it he woke and went to pull the gun on the cop. That?s what got him shot.
That and the cop. He pulled the trigger, and the outside investigative body found that the action was... Murder.



Quote:
Originally Posted by 78BO View Post
Same thing with Katrina. The federal, state, and local government told the people to leave town. They were on tv saying ?if you don?t leave you will die?. And what happened? People didn?t listen and they died. Now they want to blame the government.
I know this all might sound harsh, but if you really think about it you?ll have to agree. We as a people must take responsibility for our selves.
Are you poor, or have you ever been? If you had to evacuate, with no car, no bus, no plane, how would you leave? You wouldn't.You can't. You would try to weather the storm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 78BO View Post
As for the mortgage crisis, I work in the mortgage industry. Have for 8 yrs, but I work for the state and only server Texas Veterans (another words we aren?t crooks). Banks, car salesman, recruiters, these are people that make money off of you. You should know that they are going to do things that are not always the right thing to do. But you as an individual know what you can and cannot afford. People decided to buy a houses that they couldn?t afford. The banks helped, but ultimately it falls on the buyer to decide if they should buy that home.
A guy is selling a truck that has a bad motor and smoking, but he promises that it?ll run for ever. Do you buy? And if so and the motor blows in the first day do you blame him?
The answer is no. You knew the motor had problems. Is the guy a jerk, sure. But in the end it?s the buyers responsibility.
So then the banks aren't responsible for lending money to people who should not have been eligible for the loan? The individuals who comprise the bank aren't at fault for giving money to people they knew couldn't pay it back, because the borrowers, like all of us, thought that they would be better off down the road?

I'm all for personal responsibility, but you're talking about things 98% of the world doesn't, and can't understand. It's the strong, the wealthy, taking advantage of the lower classes. That's wrong, any way you look at it.
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Old 09-02-2010, 09:14 PM  
southern conservative

Austin, Texas
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 133 | Kudos: +15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Funetical View Post
But your saying morality in the absence of religion is non existent, but the morality of the Bible clearly details who to enslave, how to do it, and how to treat those slaves. We now know that slavery is immoral, hence the Bible is incorrect on this one.
You give the bible way too much credit. Remember it was written by man not God.
The moral values though are from god. The original 10 commandments were written by God himself. He wrote those after he had Mosses deliver the Israelites from the Egyptians slavery.
There is a pretty good write up on this topic on line. But in a nut shell here it is.
?What many fail to understand is that slavery in biblical times was very different from the slavery that was practiced in the past few centuries in many parts of the world. The slavery in the Bible was not based exclusively on race. People were not enslaved because of their nationality or the color of their skin. In Bible times, slavery was more a matter of social status. People sold themselves as slaves when they could not pay their debts or provide for their families. In New Testament times, sometimes doctors, lawyers, and even politicians were slaves of someone else. Some people actually chose to be slaves so as to have all their needs provided for by their masters.?
So again as you can see, people tend to interpret the bible in ways that fit their needs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by funetical
When was this exactly? The people of Sodom and Gomorrah were clearly not those type, so I have to ask, when did we stop working and caring? We didn't it's always been this way. You want proof it's always been this way? Plato quoting Socrates""I mean such things as these: ? when the young are tobe silent before their elders; how they are to show respect to them by
standing and making them sit; what honor is due to parents; what
garments or shoes are to be worn; the mode of dressing the hair;
deportment and manners in general. You would agree with me? ? Yes."

To sum it up "Kids these days suck" That was 2000 years ago and you still hear it.
It started in the 60?s. The hippie movement started it. They grew up and resenting their parents for making them listen, eating their vegetables, doing their chores. They took the term a FREE country to far. Just think how this county would look like if everyone practiced free love and peace to all. Nothing would have gotten done and we would have been taken over. It?s not much different now days. The only real difference is they will work because it takes money to buy the new Iphone. The parents today don?t push their kids to do their school work. Yea they push them to pass, but that?s it. With all the kids graduating college American kids are dumb compared to other countries? If we work so hard and do such a great job why do we have such a high dropout rate? Why do our own companies go to other countries to high people to work here? Why are Americans looked at as lazy and fat? If you can?t see it by now you never will.

Quote:
Originally Posted by funetical
That and the cop. He pulled the trigger, and the outside investigative body found that the action was... Murder.
No, KeyPoint Government Solutions which was the only group out of 3 or 4 that investigated the incident call the cops actions Reckless!
Here is a quote ?Acevedo last year rejected many of KeyPoint's findings, saying that he thought Quintana's tactics and force were within departmental policy.
He stood by that decision Friday. He issued a statement noting that reviews by department leaders and the police monitor and its citizens review panel "all determined that Officer Quintana's use of deadly force was objectively reasonable and within Austin Police Department policy."
He also noted that a grand jury reviewed the evidence and declined in August to indict Quintana on any charge.?
The grand jury viewed all the information. The information that we the public still have not seen. Art Acevedo is known for not pulling punches. If this cop did something wrong and it ended in a death Art would have hung him.
Quote:
Originally Posted by funetical
Are you poor, or have you ever been? If you had to evacuate, with no car, no bus, no plane, how would you leave? You wouldn't.You can't. You would try to weather the storm.
Whether or not I was poor has no standings on the matter, but to answer your question yes. And very poor to boot, along with a dad that was a drunk and beat the crap out of us. It took a while but my mom finally got the strength to stand up to him and kicked him out.

But back to the topic, these people had the chance. All they had to do was pick up the phone. Call a friend, a family member, the authorities. They could have gotten out days before it hit. But they refused to be kicked out of their homes. If it came down to me walking a 100 miles with my son on my back or taking a chance with his life, I?d be grabbing my shoes and all of the socks I have so I could keep my feet dry.

Quote:
Originally Posted by funetical
So then the banks aren't responsible for lending money to people who should not have been eligible for the loan? The individuals who comprise the bank aren't at fault for giving money to people they knew couldn't pay it back, because the borrowers, like all of us, thought that they would be better off down the road?
No the banks should not be held responsible. These people lie and cheated the system to get these houses. They lied about their income, job history. They got what they deserved. As a single parent working for the state I do NOT make a lot of money. When I went to qualify for my home loan the mortgage company said I qualified for a 175000.00 loan. I told him he was drunk! I crunched the numbers, added up my bills and knew I couldn?t swing that. I also knew that the taxes would go up after I bought so I made sure I left room for that. I did my part. I waited and bought a house that I could afford.

Quote:
Originally Posted by funetical
I'm all for personal responsibility, but you're talking about things 98% of the world doesn't, and can't understand. It's the strong, the wealthy, taking advantage of the lower classes. That's wrong, any way you look at it.
But that?s my point. People have lost the common sense that God gave them. Because they rely on others to do things for them. They have forgotten how to do things for themselves. People bought in to this idea that you can be anything you want to as long as you work hard. That?s BS!
I wanted to be a pilot. That will never happen. As bad as it sounds I have come to realize that I will always be lower middle class. I?m dyslexic, barley passed high school, and back when I graduated college was for the rich or really smart. Now I?m in a world where everyone and their mother has an associates degree or higher. I know more than my bosses, work harder than my co-workers, get more complements then anyone else from clients and yet I?m not the boss. But I?m ok with it all because I know my place in life. Yes I know that sounds bad, and I?m probably doing a bad job of explaining it. But we can?t all be rich fat cats. If we were, who would flip the burgers, mow the lawns, mine the coal or hammer the nails?
Until you realize where your place is you will never be truly happy. You?ll always be looking for more. Wishing you could be more.
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Old 09-09-2010, 03:23 PM  
INNOCENT CRIMINAL

Nashville, Tennessee
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 16 | Kudos: +10
LMAO I think you have misunderstood my sig line. But I’ll leave that to you to figure out.
I would like to comment on the knowing your place in life and as true as it is that’s what American is about starting at the bottom with the option to be anything you want.
You read like someone who has giving up even a little sour about the way things turned out for you. You say you work harder and are more qualified but are left holding that bag with no acknowledgement by promotion.

I don’t know the details of your job or environment but I can promise you that you aren’t the boss because they were rich and you wasn’t its because the battle to succeed was too great a task for you to attempt. It was the knowing your place part that held you back.

I don’t mean this as an Insult or that I am 100% correct, I just call things the way I see them.

Peace
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Undermining traditional religious morality and belief is THE KEY to making the new world order happen.
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Old 09-09-2010, 04:44 PM  
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Franklin, TN
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Quote:
No the banks should not be held responsible. These people lie and cheated the system to get these houses. They lied about their income, job history. They got what they deserved...
Well, to an extent. Sub Prime lending was indeed the banks fault, and indeed screwed over the economy when the housing market crashed. If you repossess a house once valued at $100 grand, and now worth much less you have lost money. Basic math.


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Undermining traditional religious morality and belief is THE KEY to making the new world order happen
This is true. I would terrified to see the results.
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Old 09-10-2010, 09:18 AM  
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Minot, ND
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i am a christian, and i 100% believe the sig line in the op is true.
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Old 09-10-2010, 10:30 AM  
southern conservative

Austin, Texas
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 133 | Kudos: +15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josey View Post
LMAO I think you have misunderstood my sig line. But I?ll leave that to you to figure out.
I would like to comment on the knowing your place in life and as true as it is that?s what American is about starting at the bottom with the option to be anything you want.
You read like someone who has giving up even a little sour about the way things turned out for you. You say you work harder and are more qualified but are left holding that bag with no acknowledgement by promotion.

I don?t know the details of your job or environment but I can promise you that you aren?t the boss because they were rich and you wasn?t its because the battle to succeed was too great a task for you to attempt. It was the knowing your place part that held you back.

I don?t mean this as an Insult or that I am 100% correct, I just call things the way I see them.

Peace
No offence taken, I?m the same way. Maybe I didn?t explain it like I wanted to.

With the exception of 2 ex-wives, I?m very happy with the way my life has turned out.
I have custody of my son, a great job working for the state (veteran?s benefits) I own my home, I have my car and my hotrod, a little bit of land in the country (family owned) and all of my bills are paid by the 5th of each month with money left over. My family is healthy, my friends are true friends. So as far as being happy goes I?m doing pretty dang good. Now are there some things that I don?t like, sure. I feel there are people at work that have jobs that they are not qualified for, but I also know that sometimes it?s who you know not what you know. I trained a girl at work that worked part time making more money then I do working full time. She knows the big boss. Way wrong, but that?s life and you have to be able to move on.

I guess what I was getting at is that so many took the bait and thought they could have the great American dream with out realistically looking at the facts and weighing the pros and cons. They had a dream of owning a home but never looked at the what ifs. Funetical was right in that the big guys always step on the little guys. The banks gave these loans knowing they couldn?t afford them. In the animal world it would be the same as a lion letting the deer graze on the grass. The deer thinks what a nice lion. But once the deer is fat the lion eats the deer. That is life. Same principles just different out comes.

Oh, and I think I get your statement now. New world order bad mabe?
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Old 09-10-2010, 11:16 AM  
INNOCENT CRIMINAL

Nashville, Tennessee
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 16 | Kudos: +10
Glad to read it wasn't a chip on your shoulder.
I have a payroll of over 21 people and in my opinion none of them work for the money.
Its always just do the bare min. to get by. What passes for a hard day of work today, would be laughed at 20 years ago. People have no drive and want satisfaction instantly.

And the biggest mistake I see every payday is they all spend everything they make every week. Golden rule you learn first first job is never spend everything you make.
I do feel ya on someone getting a head by favors all I can say is life isn't fair and I think thats pretty much what you posted.

Congrats on finding a peaceful place to call your own & acknowledging God while you do it.
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