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Old 10-19-2008, 11:00 PM  
LMC
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Originally Posted by kubbe View Post
Thanks to LMC and Councilman Jones for attending the neighborhood meeting this afternoon. Glad you both came and shared with us. I look forward to the debate tomorrow.
Kubbe,
Thank you for the opportunity. The audience members were outstanding and I appreciated the insight on issues facing our community.
Best Wishes, Lisa Marie
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Old 10-20-2008, 07:03 AM  
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Originally Posted by jeepster View Post
I know this is an older post re. this thread, but, no, I haven't priced sidewalks lately. How much are they per square foot ? How many sidewalks would Chris' "branding" money build ? There are many areas of town where widening the streets are impossible, yet they need sidewalks. The city has "right of way" along all streets. I can think of only a few places where it is physically impossible to put in a sidewalk. Why haven't they been built ? Labor isn't a problem. As has been pointed out, city crews spend inordinate amounts of time hanging out at "the barn", "the shed", "the garage", and numerous other places waiting for an assignment. Let's have them build sidewalks, and if a pipe bursts the water crew can leave, etc. But just ignoring the problem means it will only get more expensive. As asked before, when do you expect the cost of building sidewalks to come down ? And again, what's stopping the city from putting a sidewalk on Chestnut St. hill, it's been needed since the sixties. Apparently the only thing stopping it is the will of the city council. Being for it is okay for a challenger, not having done it is failure for an incumbent.
Are builders/developers required to put in sidewalks during construction inside the city limits ? If not, why not ? So the city can put them in later at greater expense ? I'm sure someone will say it, but it's just plain asinine to say that the cost of putting a sidewalk in during construction of a home will price it out of range of homebuyers. Yet that is the argument builders have used for years. Only the idiots "we" have elected to successive city councils would buy that load. I've been here since 66 and I can't name one council member I think did a good job.
Not one person supporting Chris Jones has cited a specific accomplishment of his. Apparently there are none. No one wants to "trot out" his record. He went door to door to "tame" a neighborhood, problem solved I'm sure. That's a great reason to re-elect him. He can "grow" some more and maybe actually do something with results one day. I predict that the only thing he will ever accomplish is use the council as a stepping stone to higher office. Incumbents have a psychological advantage among those who project their needs and inadequacy upon elected officials they confuse with paternal figures. So the lame re-elect the lame. And the beat goes on.

I'll try and get you a price. But I'm pretty sure the city can't build sidewalks with it's crews due to the state constitutional prohibition on competition with private companies. Same as the city, state, and county on roads. Chestnut, sidewalks no problem, you're serious?

As far as I can tell the best reason to support Jones is he seems to be grounded in reality, not fantasy.
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Old 10-20-2008, 08:43 AM  
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A sidewalk on Chestnut is a high priority and there have been several attempts to get it done. It is on the CIP for about $100,000, but I suspect that this is only for the section on the hill, behind The Tavern, which will need a fair amount of extra work.

Sidewalks the length of Chestnut, with no unusual challenges, would cost $250,000 to $500,000. I would guess, based on the length of that particular section, that the hill behind The Tavern adds $50,000 +/- to the project.

As to why it has not been done before, I don't know. I suspect it has something to do with the price tag and the fact that LBJ has far more traffic and is in far worse shape and probably needs to be done first.

If you then want to ask why LBJ has not been done, then we need to get into the entire CIP and how the projects have been prioritized.

Now, whether we could select better contractors, or structure the contracts in a manner that encourages early completion is another matter, as is whether projects are being planned and contracts awarded as quickly as possible.
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Old 10-20-2008, 11:06 AM  
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Sidewalk Insanity

The only sidewalk I've ever witnessed under construction in SM was done by a city crew. That was some years ago and I would not be surprised if there were an insane law now directing such work to the "good old boy" network. However, I am not aware of such a law at this time.
The hill on Chestnut is where a sidewalk is most desperately needed. Above that, the last few blocks are on a much wider section of street.

As a former masonry contractor I can assure that $100,000 for a sidewalk on Chestnut would put a tidy little profit in my bank account. I can also assure you that if it goes to a politically connected private company in the good old boy network it will cost much more.
One more time, a sidewalk is a thin, narrow ribbon of concrete with reinforcing wire (sometimes rebar-even better). Done to top notch specs and beyond it is mostly a labor expense.
There used to be a sidewalk on the east side of Chestnut. If it had been done properly we wouldn't have an issue here.
Properly mixed and cured concrete shouldn't begin to deteriorate for over 200 years. You're not likely to have seen any concrete work around here done properly. Concrete contractors tend to be the most ignorant low life in the construction trades.
And again, the cost of sidewalks will keep going up and the need will never go away, putting it off is insanity.
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Old 10-20-2008, 12:59 PM  
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Originally Posted by jeepster View Post
Concrete contractors tend to be the most ignorant low life in the construction trades.
.
So why the hell would they want to build you a sidewalk?
That is the most ignorant comment made to date! You win the stupid comment award Hands Down !!
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Old 10-20-2008, 01:42 PM  
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Originally Posted by jeepster View Post
As a former masonry contractor I can assure that... Concrete contractors tend to be the most ignorant low life in the construction trades.
While I won't dispute your characterization of yourself, I will say this:

First of all, to not do the whole street is stupid. We don't need any more of the sidewalk on this block, but not on the next block bull**** that they built back "in the good ol days" when everyone was baked all day.

There would be nearly 6,000 linear feet of sidewalk on Chestnut, assuming there would even be room for a sidewalk on both sides, which there wouldn't. Even if it were only on one side, that works out to about 3,000 linear feet.

Please enlighten us as to the work involved, including prep work, which would allow you to put down 3,000 linear feet of sidewalk, that would last for 200 years, for $33 per linear foot, and put a tidy profit in your bank account.

To help you get started, here are some other cities that were dumb enough to pay $70-100 per linear foot.

http://townhall.townofchapelhill.org...oject_list.htm

http://www.ci.olympia.wa.us/document...nalysisSTF.pdf

http://www.swcrpc.org/content/transp...Assessment.pdf

That works out to $200,000 for the cheapest estimate, along one side of the road, to $560,000 for the highest estimate, along both sides of the road. Then, there is the fact that the actuals for one of these came is at 3x the estimates, but the terrain along Chestnut is about as easy to build as it gets, I'm sure.
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Old 10-20-2008, 03:02 PM  
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Weenie Whiney Woosie White Boy Award

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Originally Posted by Immis View Post
So why the hell would they want to build you a sidewalk?
That is the most ignorant comment made to date! You win the stupid comment award Hands Down !!
They wouldn't be building me a sidewalk, they would be building for the city. If you mean why would they work for me, they wouldn't. I hired only good, hard workers. Digging a trench and pouring concrete ain't rocket science. Anyone with a brain and a good set of standards can put in a sidewalk. That large companies charge so much is more a testament to political corruption/stupidity than actual cost.
My comment is based on experience.
Yours is ignorant and stupid. And wallowing in that ignorance and stupidity is a good place for someone like you. It keeps you from causing any real trouble.
They must miss you on the short bus.
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Old 10-20-2008, 04:08 PM  
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Originally Posted by jeepster View Post
That large companies charge so much is more a testament to political corruption/stupidity than actual cost.
Well then, as a concerned and obviously very knowledgeable citizen, I look forward to meeting you when you show up at City Council to educate everyone on how we could reduce by 75% the cost to develop the infrastructure we so desperately need.

You'll know me by the stunned look on my face. I'll be the one mouthing "I can't believe he really exists."
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Old 10-20-2008, 04:18 PM  
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Building A Bigger Beast

Quote:
Originally Posted by semi-native View Post
While I won't dispute your characterization of yourself, I will say this:

First of all, to not do the whole street is stupid. We don't need any more of the sidewalk on this block, but not on the next block bull**** that they built back "in the good ol days" when everyone was baked all day.

There would be nearly 6,000 linear feet of sidewalk on Chestnut, assuming there would even be room for a sidewalk on both sides, which there wouldn't. Even if it were only on one side, that works out to about 3,000 linear feet.

Please enlighten us as to the work involved, including prep work, which would allow you to put down 3,000 linear feet of sidewalk, that would last for 200 years, for $33 per linear foot, and put a tidy profit in your bank account.

To help you get started, here are some other cities that were dumb enough to pay $70-100 per linear foot.

http://townhall.townofchapelhill.org...oject_list.htm

http://www.ci.olympia.wa.us/document...nalysisSTF.pdf

http://www.swcrpc.org/content/transp...Assessment.pdf

That works out to $200,000 for the cheapest estimate, along one side of the road, to $560,000 for the highest estimate, along both sides of the road. Then, there is the fact that the actuals for one of these came is at 3x the estimates, but the terrain along Chestnut is about as easy to build as it gets, I'm sure.
First of all, you apparently have a confused opinion about masonry and concrete contractors being the same. That would be the only insult lower than calling a master stone mason a "builders mason". I will assume that error was based on ignorance and uncontrollable bile production.

The badly damaged sidewalk on the east side of Chestnut was not built in the sixties. If you think everyone who smoked weed was "baked" all day then you need to read the When The Hippies... thread. The only studies done on pot smokers at work showed they are/were the best and most dependable. Read "The Emperor Wears No Clothes" for free on the Re-Legalization thread.
A little knowledge might be upsetting to you, but it won't kill you.

The bit about not doing the whole street was granting you and the other mongrels a break on city expenses that must keep you awake at night. Insisting that it all must be done as well as adding another sidewalk (both sides) to run up the footage and expense to a point where you then had an expensive beast to attack is beyond ridiculous. Never expose the mad shadows of your mind to the light of day.

The cost to other cities may be due to corruption (kickbacks), stupidity, lack of competition, wording bid requirements improperly, heavy traffic and many other location specific requirements. The bigger the company doing the job the higher the cost. Economies of scale are turned upside down by large investor owned top heavy construction companies. A properly written contract does not allow for cost overruns. Jobs done on estimates or cost plus are always out of control. Lose control - lose money.

Measure the hill (one side only) that I think should have a sidewalk, figure in local labor and material costs and you will find the beast is not so formidable or expensive. Do I think the city could find a way to double (or triple or more) the cost. Hell yes. Stupid is as stupid does.

Everyone seems to agree that it needs to be done. WHEN WILL IT GET CHEAPER? Why hasn't it been done?

When did sidewalks start triggering Junkie Limbaugh tirades replete with redefined context, insults and nonsensical financial connotations?
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Old 10-20-2008, 04:26 PM  
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San Marcos
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*yaaaaawn*

http://www.hoovers.com/concrete-and-...le-basic.xhtml

http://www.omegamasonry.com/masonry-services.html

http://www.mcmca.com/

http://storefront.dexonline.com/dive...nry-contractor
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