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-   -   Should Alcohol in Public be Illegal? (https://www.cityprofile.com/forum/general-city-discussion/should-alcohol-public-illegal-18479/)

Keith 07-08-2011 09:07 AM

Should Alcohol in Public be Illegal?
 
Locally they debating making all the local parks alcohol free zones.

Do you agree?

RiponredTJ 07-08-2011 09:30 AM

It has been like that here for many years. It's not a bad thing imo, it keeps rowdyness and unsavory activities down.

People tend to still drink sureptitiously in parks despite the law, but it is much more subtle and less likely to get out of hand.

havasu 07-08-2011 09:36 AM

In the city I worked in, they banned any alcoholic beverages in the parks and any open spaces, in an attempt to erradicate the large transient population who were setting up encampments by the public restrooms. This worked fantastic to move them away from the public, or returned then into the jails for non-compliance of these laws.

Speedbump 07-08-2011 09:53 AM

I don't like giving up any of my rights. I've already seen enough of them taken by the Government. I don't trust them and I'm not going for anything they propose.

TheStigX 07-08-2011 10:02 AM

Stupid idea. We already did this back in the 20's.....anyone forget about that?

havasu 07-08-2011 10:02 AM

Speedbump? Is that you? Welcome!

TonyH 07-08-2011 10:29 AM

I say no. I am not a drinker at all but I am sick of how legislation is big on Not enforcing the laws that exist and just make more laws that hurt everyone.
In this case. Cops should lock up the rowdies that get out of hand but let the casual, safe drinker enjoy a day off at the Park.
I hate that many Parks are closed at Sunset. I enjoy walking the beach and watching the sunset. Or walking the beach during a Full Moon. Instead of hammering the few bad eggs, they come along and say Parks closed at sunset. Spoils the fun for the innocent. Enforce the laws on the few and let 'the masses' enjoy themselves.
Brookhaven Township is famous for saying "NO" to everything that used to be fun just because it's easier then enforcing order.

RiponredTJ 07-08-2011 10:32 AM

^ I completely agree with this ^

remmons 07-08-2011 10:39 AM

I am not a drinker, but I use to be a casual drinker many years back.

I like what TonyH had to say, and I agree with him.

I don't mind the casual drinker at the park relaxing and unwinding from a loooong work week, but when the party gets out of hand, my kids don't need to see that. Don't make new laws that we can't keep up with, just enforce the ones that we already have. Don't let a few bad apples spoil the whole barrel (although it is funnier than heck to watch a totally plasterd person fall all over their self).

At bars and clubs, they (usually) have designated drivers. How about at the park? I wonder if they think about who is driving home after the barbecue?

zacmac1003 07-08-2011 10:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheStigX (Post 115346)
Stupid idea. We already did this back in the 20's.....anyone forget about that?

That was prohibition which banned all alcohol everywhere this is talking about banning alcohol from public places like parks which I believe is a good idea I don't like haveing my family around drunken idiots when we are out, plus if these ppl drink at the park they will eventually leave and then we have ppl drunk and driving

Jim_Rockford 07-08-2011 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zacmac1003 (Post 115380)
That was prohibition which banned all alcohol everywhere this is talking about banning alcohol from public places like parks which I believe is a good idea I don't like haveing my family around drunken idiots when we are out, plus if these ppl drink at the park they will eventually leave and then we have ppl drunk and driving

Its just the first step to banning it all together, Like every other law they make local, state and federal law makers have figured out how to boil the frog slowly instead of dropping it into boiling water. we just shrug the new law off and accept it and next thing we know we are under total control. All government agencies need to start enforcing the laws we have then there would be no need to make new ones we can't enforce. :brickwall:

SwampYankee 07-08-2011 11:12 AM

I don't think public alcohol consumption should be illegal but I have no problem with them cracking down on public intoxication.

mkfarnam 07-08-2011 11:15 AM

Here some our parks and lakes already have designated areas for alcohol use.

I've drank when I was younger, but only on occasion to be sociable.
I never did like the taste of any of it.

Tabacco was banned from being used in public in California and many other states, so why not do the same with beer and alcohol.
Tax the hell out of alcohol and ban the use of it inside city limits except for bars and designated areas.
I don't think it's fair to be banned from recreational parks and pic-nic and camping sites outside the city.
Taxing it like they did tabacco would slow down the use of it more than a ban would.
IMO.

Mike1084 07-08-2011 11:18 AM

They tried this once in 1920 it was called prohibition. It was a failure in North America and elsewhere, as bootlegging became widespread. Chicago became notorious as a haven for prohibition dodgers and organized crime took control of the distribution of alcohol. It caused much more problems than it resolved. Distilleries and breweries in Canada, Mexico, and the Caribbean flourished as their products were either consumed by visiting Americans or illegally imported to the U.S.

MorePower 07-08-2011 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zacmac1003 (Post 115380)
That was prohibition which banned all alcohol everywhere this is talking about banning alcohol from public places like parks which I believe is a good idea I don't like haveing my family around drunken idiots when we are out, plus if these ppl drink at the park they will eventually leave and then we have ppl drunk and driving

First of its already illegal to be drunk in public. They give tickets out for that all the time. And TonyH said enforce the laws already enstated.

Anyone that believes someone having a beer or two is a drunken idiot is ignorant. A beer or two over a few hours will not make you drunk. Not to mention beer is one of the healthiest drinks available today with all the other sugar infused drinks market to the public.

BrewBoy 07-08-2011 11:29 AM

Texas state parks have, for years, had rules that stated "Public Consumption of Alcohol Prohibited". I always took that to mean that I could have it under an insulator and drink it, as long as nobody knows what I'm drinking. As long as I was behaving myself, and I did, nobody cared. Sort of a "don't ask, don't tell" policy.

Unfortunately, there are always a few @$$holes than ruin it for us all.

mrcoolface 07-08-2011 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike1084 (Post 115401)
They tried this once in 1920 it was called prohibition. It was a failure in North America and elsewhere, as bootlegging became widespread. Chicago became notorious as a haven for prohibition dodgers and organized crime took control of the distribution of alcohol. It caused much more problems than it resolved. Distilleries and breweries in Canada, Mexico, and the Caribbean flourished as their products were either consumed by visiting Americans or illegally imported to the U.S.

the same can be said on the war on drugs. every time America declares war on something it improves what they declare war on. all drugs should be legal, you can buy heroin and meth at the pharmacy but they are legal because they are in patented pills. the government does not work for you. it works for whoever throws the most money at the law makers.

VaporLung 07-08-2011 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike1084 (Post 115401)
They tried this once in 1920 it was called prohibition. It was a failure in North America and elsewhere, as bootlegging became widespread. Chicago became notorious as a haven for prohibition dodgers and organized crime took control of the distribution of alcohol. It caused much more problems than it resolved. Distilleries and breweries in Canada, Mexico, and the Caribbean flourished as their products were either consumed by visiting Americans or illegally imported to the U.S.

The same can be said about prohibition in many areas of the black market, at least we learned *some* lessons when alcohol prohibition was repealed.

I dont think banning alcohol in public places will work out too well. Too many 'outdoor' events will greatly suffer if this is the case.

Just better enforce the laws already in place please.

Awesome 07-08-2011 12:00 PM

Letting people drink in public areas ALWAYS leads to people getting drunk and rowdy. It also means our rivers, lakes and parks are full of used beer cans and bottles. I can't believe it when I go down to the beautiful river near here and there is broken glass all over the place.

I am one who doesn't like seeing more stupid laws, but this one would be a forward step in public safety.

Now they just need to reverse the anti-gun laws. :P

HiHood 07-08-2011 12:05 PM

It's already unlawfull to be intoxicated in public, I say we simply enforce the laws we have. Too many laws and not enough enforcement. Train and hire more cops.

mrcoolface 07-08-2011 12:13 PM

they need to enforce littering laws and instead of just a fine you have to spend a few weeks picking up litter.

Songbird 07-08-2011 12:18 PM

This is a backdoor to making alcohol illegal by consent of the sheeple.. Piece by piece--step by step!


A New Prohibition
The universal application of ignition interlocks will translate into a de facto Prohibition. Soon, anti-alcohol groups and the auto and interlock industries will overcome the technological and regulatory barriers to making these devices standard equipment.

For a myriad of legal and political reasons, universal ignition interlocks will be set at low enough levels to prevent adults from having even one drink prior to driving.

Say goodbye to enjoying a glass of wine with dinner, a beer at a ball game, or a champagne toast at a wedding. The only barrier between these activist groups and a universal mandate is whether or not the public accepts the technology.

"The public, though, has to accept these things, or they won't work.”
MADD President Laura Dean-Mooney

Find out how interlocks could lead to a new prohibition.

Interlock Facts

Interlocks: The New Prohibition - Interlock Facts

camiller 07-08-2011 12:22 PM

We had such a ban in Nebraska and recently repealed it.

gregs887 07-08-2011 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Awesome (Post 115414)
Letting people drink in public areas ALWAYS leads to people getting drunk and rowdy. It also means our rivers, lakes and parks are full of used beer cans and bottles. I can't believe it when I go down to the beautiful river near here and there is broken glass all over the place.

I am one who doesn't like seeing more stupid laws, but this one would be a forward step in public safety.

Now they just need to reverse the anti-gun laws. :P

Enforce the laws already on the books. Littering is already illegal and punishable by hefty fines. What makes you honestly think that a public alcohol ban will make lakes and rivers cleaner? The type of person that is going to litter in the first place is the same type that will ignore a public drinking ban. Effectively nothing changes except that you or I would face criminal charges for wanting to have a beer while camping or during a bbq at a park or beach.

gregs887 07-08-2011 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zacmac1003 (Post 115380)
That was prohibition which banned all alcohol everywhere this is talking about banning alcohol from public places like parks which I believe is a good idea I don't like haveing my family around drunken idiots when we are out, plus if these ppl drink at the park they will eventually leave and then we have ppl drunk and driving

Are you serious? It is already illegal to be drunk in public. If someone is getting rowdy and out of hand because they are trashed it already is illegal. Driving drunk is illegal. Why do we need another law? Banning alcohol for everyone else solves nothing. :brickwall:



Oh wait, I forgot...
https://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f7...ildren_186.jpg

mckbrew 07-08-2011 12:58 PM

I personally feel these laws are too restrictive as it is. I've seen numerous places where I would have loved to have the option to take in the view and responsibly enjoy 1 or 2 drinks but couldn't due to laws.

drathbone 07-08-2011 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Songbird (Post 115433)
Say goodbye to enjoying a glass of wine with dinner, a beer at a ball game, or a champagne toast at a wedding. The only barrier between these activist groups and a universal mandate is whether or not the public accepts the technology.

If you really believe a new age prohibition is on it's way you mustn't understand simple economics. The local, state and federal government makes in the billions on alcohol tax revenue. That's not just for the consumption, I'm talking from grain to bottle and everything in between.

If you think they are going to slowly trickle down with legislation to completely eliminate the consumption of alcohol, you're flat out wrong. Millions of jobs like farmers, suppliers, shippers, wholesalers etc would be eliminated. Last I checked, we're trying to get people jobs, not destroy the economy more by eliminating them.

But I digress. In Virginia, there is what's called an "open container" law. Essentially, this law is in effect everywhere. Meaning you cannot posses a container that is unsealed (open) containing alcohol in a public place. Do I think people can enjoy a drink or two responsibly? Yes. Do I believe that people cannot enjoy drinks responsibly? Yes - law or not this will still happen and does happen where I live.

mrcoolface 07-08-2011 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drathbone (Post 115451)
If you really believe a new age prohibition is on it's way you mustn't understand simple economics. The local, state and federal government makes in the billions on alcohol tax revenue. That's not just for the consumption, I'm talking from grain to bottle and everything in between.

If you think they are going to slowly trickle down with legislation to completely eliminate the consumption of alcohol, you're flat out wrong. Millions of jobs like farmers, suppliers, shippers, wholesalers etc would be eliminated. Last I checked, we're trying to get people jobs, not destroy the economy more by eliminating them.

that sounds just like the cannabis prohibition except instead of making money they throw money away

BobbyBraggot 07-08-2011 01:28 PM

In Europe they allow drinking in public-even have beer vending machines. But they have tough drunk driving laws and enforce laws against public drunkenness.

Lainatan 07-08-2011 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Speedbump
I don't like giving up any of my rights. I've already seen enough of them taken by the Government. I don't trust them and I'm not going for anything they propose.

I agree 100%

da3394 07-08-2011 01:41 PM

I do not use alchol but we have too many things banned and/or illegal now. This is supposed to be the "Land of the Free", are we a bunch of wimps?

schuweet 07-08-2011 01:49 PM

Enforce PI/MIP. The root of the problem is not enforcing the laws already on the books.

blucher 07-08-2011 01:50 PM

Things like Renaissance Fairs & Octoberfests would disappear without that income. Still there are places like parks that are usually posted as alcohol free so people do have choices.

waddsworth 07-08-2011 01:51 PM

Some of my most cherished experiences in life combined enjoying some delicious craft beer and nature's glory. I remember this river I went to in Virginia - it was like paradise. Lots of people were hanging out on the rocks, enjoying some brews, swimming. It was a nice atmosphere and nobody was out-of-hand. I didn't witness anybody littering, nor did I see any evidence of previous visitors littering. Part of what made it great was that it felt like freedom AND community at the same time.

But I've also seen the bad side - The "Thunder on the Boardwalk" airshow in Atlantic City, NJ. The beach gets really crowded, and there is no enforcement of open containers/alcohol. I saw soooooooooo many a-holes leaving their cans and bottles in the sand when there were trashcans within 20 yards. I spent a lot of time that day taking it upon myself to pick up some of the trash that others left behind. It was depressing and infuriating at the same time. People who do that s**t should be thrown in jail.

blucher 07-08-2011 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrcoolface (Post 115424)
they need to enforce littering laws and instead of just a fine you have to spend a few weeks picking up litter.

I would LOVE seeing that!

StLouisCardsFan 07-08-2011 02:13 PM

Enforce Existing Laws Before Adding New Regulations
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TonyH (Post 115375)
I say no. I am not a drinker at all but I am sick of how legislation is big on Not enforcing the laws that exist and just make more laws that hurt everyone.
In this case. Cops should lock up the rowdies that get out of hand but let the casual, safe drinker enjoy a day off at the Park.
I hate that many Parks are closed at Sunset. I enjoy walking the beach and watching the sunset. Or walking the beach during a Full Moon. Instead of hammering the few bad eggs, they come along and say Parks closed at sunset. Spoils the fun for the innocent. Enforce the laws on the few and let 'the masses' enjoy themselves.
Brookhaven Township is famous for saying "NO" to everything that used to be fun just because it's easier then enforcing order.

I agree with Tony and everyone else who raise the point about lack of enforcement of existing laws. Laziness leads to lack of enforcement which leads to creation of additional behavior modifying regulation. Enforcement of existing laws sends the message of seriousness which leads to compliance thus reducing the need for additional regulation. Lack of enforcement teaches people that they don't need to comply with the law and they don't need to exercise personal responsibility and the "do-gooders" think it's a failure of specificity about what is intended. This causes a need for clarification, special exemptions, loopholes, etc. Enough is enough! Stop stealing our liberties because a few lowlifes are to stupid or too lazy to follow the rules.:cheers2:

whitetail072854 07-08-2011 02:56 PM

No
 
No, they tried prohabition once and it did not work then and it will not work now and that is what the "do gooders" are after again. Take it away a little bit at a time till there is nothing left. Like all of our other constitutional rights that are being denied us.

jed 07-08-2011 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SwampYankee (Post 115396)
I don't think public alcohol consumption should be illegal but I have no problem with them cracking down on public intoxication.

I fully agree, just enforce the laws on the books.

Tinkerin 07-08-2011 03:21 PM

Common Sense, common decency, not common law
 
It's much a matter of the current and younger generations being taught respect for others, and perhaps themselves in the process. That will never be legislated.

A federal park we love to boat at has a 'no alcohol' policy- actually I think they all do. However, enforcement is common sense. The rangers know that many, if not most of the casual boaters (especially on the weekend and holiday weekends) have alcohol. They even weave in and out of the 'redneck yacht club' tieups where it's pretty clear that the insulated can holders don't have soda...but, you know, unless someone is being stupid, the rangers leave it alone. They let the adults quietly enjoy adult beverage with each other. Someone loud and rowdy...oops, they just got 'inspected' and in many cases, rightfully towed. It's a good balance... a policy in place to enforce if needed, and common decency/sense from law enforcement. Makes it a right enjoyable place to go. Oh, I don't drink, but my wife certainly enjoys having 1-2 beers over the course of 4-6 hours sitting in the sun with snacks. Do we need hassled about that? Really?

For the person concerned about littering...careful of what you wish for. People will still take booze cans and bottles with them where it's forbidden, but...it's a lot less risky to throw those empty containers out than get caught with them in your garbage, back pack, cooler or hand. Your 'prohibition' in public places will more likely than not lead to MORE litter rather than less. I've seen it with open container laws in this state. People who used to save their empties to recycle simply toss them now to avoid being 'caught' with them. Unintended consequences.

Yes, crack down on the visibly intoxicated and rowdies. The laws are on the books as nearly everyone has stated. Heck, forget about parks and rivers for a minute, how about pro and college sporting events? Talk about not being able to take children someplace? You can't even escape the profane vulgar bombardment you get at these places now unless you want to leave the venue. It's embarrassing for the human race. No common decency, no common sense. No respect of others.

Respect for others is where it all starts. Not more laws.

Grunge 07-08-2011 03:25 PM

From cigarettes to alcohol
 
I being an x-smoker have watched the well crafted attack on cigarette smoke by the same government that was making billions from the tobacco industry. They started small with banning it in hospitals, then creating a lawsuit against the big business tobacco lobby, and last I have watched them ban cigarette smoking in all business's weather the owner of the business wanted to or not and have watched multiple once active places fail and go out of business. I said then you watch alcohol will be next as it will first be large open public places and then anyplace where one *might* get drunk and become rowdy..

I point out that this type of thing is not stopping the drunks just stopping regular everyday people from enjoying their rights. watch first tobacco, then alcohol, then caffeine, then red meat and any other thing a small group of people can find any fault with...

Don't stop the process enforce the laws against the ones who screw it up for everyone else

Just watch something you enjoy will be next......


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