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Old 11-19-2012, 02:05 PM  
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Kent, Ohio
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Originally Posted by YelloJeep View Post
I understand. That is why I said a MAJORITY of liberals. There are two very general sides in this country (of which you seem to fall somewhat in the middle...
Here is an illustration (that I like, anyway) that I think shows how these two sides cannot relate to one another. Me? I couldn't imagine living somewhere where many people had never driven a car, or got around mostly on public transit. Others couldn't imagine being able to walk out into their back yard and fire off an AK-47... Of course, the ones who live in an urban environment and haven't spent any time outside of that are more prone to say there needs to be more gun restricions. But me, who can walk outside and shoot if I want to any time of day or night, don't want those folks deciding for me. Unfortunately with population growth and growth of urban areas the latter will overwhlm the former. That is a direction we are going.

I do understand your point... BUT if you look at the states that are clearly quite liberal they will generally have higher gun restricions.
I don't think you do understand my point. My point is that a majority of liberals don't give a rat's ass. They did in the 80's and into the 90's, but lost interest as the crime rate fell. The idea that liberals are die-hard anti-gun is about 15 years out of date. 30-some states have gone pro-gun since the AWB was passed, including 7 of the 9 swing states I mentioned. Most states have legislatures with mechanisms similar to the Senate filibuster. These states don't adopt pro-gun policies and remain swing states unless the liberals tolerate pro-gun policies. In many areas, neither liberal nor conservatives are viable candidates unless they are pro-gun.

My point is that California, Chicago, and several other anti-gun strongholds are the exception, not the rule. Americans are pro-gun with a relative few exceptions.

My point is that *all* of the anti-gun liberals I personally know are foreigners. I don't personally know *any* American, anti-gun liberals. That stereotype may have been true at some point in time, but today, it's a gross exaggeration.
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Old 11-19-2012, 02:24 PM  
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Greenville, SC
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Originally Posted by rivalarrival View Post
I don't think you do understand my point. My point is that a majority of liberals don't give a rat's ass. They did in the 80's and into the 90's, but lost interest as the crime rate fell. The idea that liberals are die-hard anti-gun is about 15 years out of date. 30-some states have gone pro-gun since the AWB was passed, including 7 of the 9 swing states I mentioned. Most states have legislatures with mechanisms similar to the Senate filibuster. These states don't adopt pro-gun policies and remain swing states unless the liberals tolerate pro-gun policies. In many areas, neither liberal nor conservatives are viable candidates unless they are pro-gun.

My point is that California, Chicago, and several other anti-gun strongholds are the exception, not the rule. Americans are pro-gun with a relative few exceptions.

My point is that *all* of the anti-gun liberals I personally know are foreigners. I don't personally know *any* American, anti-gun liberals. That stereotype may have been true at some point in time, but today, it's a gross exaggeration.
Okay, fair enough. Gun control is not a big issue among liberals nowadays. Candidates don't stand much of a chance on a anti-gun platform. I do hear some liberal types talking about "reasonable gun control" whatever that means.... So you don't hear any of that?

Rant a little here if you will excuse me....I see and hear on our local news about people getting shot and killed commiting crimes.... Then they interview the criminals' parents or family members and they are crying about how "...he shouldn't have been killed that way..." and "...why aren't they being charged with something....".....
So are those the types that are against legal firearms?
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Old 11-19-2012, 05:29 PM  
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Kent, Ohio
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Originally Posted by YelloJeep View Post
Okay, fair enough. Gun control is not a big issue among liberals nowadays. Candidates don't stand much of a chance on a anti-gun platform. I do hear some liberal types talking about "reasonable gun control" whatever that means.... So you don't hear any of that?
"Reasonable" and "Sensible" are words that can mean just about anything to anyone, so we'd have to get into specifics. I've seen some crap attributed to Senator Diane Feinstein that calls for another Clinton-esque gun ban, (but one that would not include any "grandfather" clauses). I doubt that such a bill would find popular support even among just the democrats in Congress; I don't think it would be considered sensible.

I haven't heard any huge backlash from gun-lovers against instant background checks, so I'm considering that a "sensible" restriction. I've heard some rumblings on the ideas of closing the "gun show loophole" and requiring all sales be conducted through an FFL, but I haven't seen any significant efforts to achieve either. (But, those two could probably be considered pretty close to "sensible")

I have seen Democratic blowback against the Clinton AWB - 65 House Democrats wrote Holder and Obama saying they would not support reinstating the AWB.


Quote:

Rant a little here if you will excuse me....I see and hear on our local news about people getting shot and killed commiting crimes.... Then they interview the criminals' parents or family members and they are crying about how "...he shouldn't have been killed that way..." and "...why aren't they being charged with something....".....
So are those the types that are against legal firearms?
That "type" doesn't worry me. The voting bloc of "relatives of people lawfully killed with a firearm" is rather small. The "type" that worries me are those who have learned everything they know about guns from Hollywood, where good-guy civilians with guns are portrayed as bumbling incompetents or paranoid morons; where only cops and bad guys know how to use guns competently. This group seems to be shrinking, at least in most states.
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Old 11-19-2012, 07:39 PM  
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Originally Posted by YelloJeep View Post
You guys keep talking about ... "Europe is better"..... "European methods"....... "More like Europe...".... Why the heck do you all want to change this place to be like Europe? Why don't you GO to Europe??
Europe is so much more progressive and open minded than America. They believe that global warming is actually a possibility, and is taking steps to deal with it, as opposed to America, who continues to bury our heads. Europe is light years ahead in terms of high speed rail, solar, and conservation. America is all about glut, gut and greed. If I could go to Europe, I would, believe me. I like the thought of a country that takes care of its people as opposed to this country, loaded with people like you, who, if you were in charge, we'd all be praying, on our own for medical, no paid vacations, basically, here, it's all about the "bend over and take it"!
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