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Old 12-13-2010, 09:41 AM  
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Originally Posted by havasu View Post
Yes, the Opium question was for discussion purposes only. I also guess you could add alcohol into the equation. Where do we draw the line? Marijuana is OK, but Opium is not.
Then what about mushrooms, or peyote? They all have medical benefits, and as a matter of fact, some are legal for American Indians to possess for their native rituals.

I personally believe the opening of the doors to legalized marijuana is opening the doors to a big pandora's box.
Same thing, Mushrooms and LSD don't cause dependence.

Not my thing, personally I prefer to keep a grip, but if you are in your own house, doing your thing, why do I care? It's not socially degenerative, Crack for instance, is just that. Addiction is an issue, not the substance in and of themselves. If a substance is non addictive, what's the harm?

As a former LEO, I'm sure you saw the impact drugs have on people, but how many people called you to let you know all was well? The numbers indicate their are more Pot/ Mushroom users, recreational users not having issues. The underlying issue is socioeconomic.

There's a rise in painkiller addiction in the 50 plus group (all over actually), but there isn't a war to stop it, the economics of it are more beneficial than the social detractors.

It boils down to cash, you got it? Make policy. You don't? Prison time.
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Old 12-13-2010, 01:18 PM  
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If a substance is non addictive, what's the harm?
*Points back to my LD50 comment*

But then again I guess we could venture to say that the LD50 rating kind of goes hand in hand with the addiction rating too. (Especially in this case)


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It boils down to cash, you got it? Make policy. You don't? Prison time.
QFT. Sadly...
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Old 12-13-2010, 01:55 PM  
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Pot definitely is a gateway drug...

I don't know why I get so invested in this - I know it's not going to happen!
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Old 12-13-2010, 05:21 PM  
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Seeing as this thread is in the Politics section, does no one else care whether or not the government legally has ANY say in ANYTHING we ingest, whether it's relatively harmless pot or very harmful methamphetamines?

The nature of the drug, whether it's dangerous or not or whether it's addictive or not, is moot when considering whether or not government has the legal authority to restrict it.

I remind you that back in 1918, the government recognized that it didn't have the authority to ban alcohol outright, so an amendment to the Constitution was ratified to give the Federal government authority to ban it. Today, our government doesn't bother with arcane concerns like worrying about the Supreme Law of the Land. But I digress.
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Old 12-13-2010, 06:44 PM  
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Pot definitely is a gateway drug...

I don't know why I get so invested in this - I know it's not going to happen!
The reason its a gateway drug is because its illegal.
Nothing pisses me off more than having to (theoretically) acquire my meds from the same guy who is in possession or the business of selling other things I have no interest in and/or agree with being illegal. (Or regulated)

I guess the same can be said about alcohol, or caffeine, or...

Sugar - I still remember being exposed to cigarettes, nudie magazines and condoms behind the counter of the convenience store when I was a kid. Does this make my candy bar the gateway to me smoking cigarettes and having sex now? I mean, isnt EDUCATION and guidance what helped me make those decisions eventually?
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Old 12-14-2010, 01:57 AM  
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Did you honeatly just compare marijauna and hardcore drugs to a candy bar and cigarettes? I think anyone can agree that's kind of a moot comparison.

And I don't think marijuana is a gateway drug because it's illegal. I DO think once you do a drug and experience it for the first time (which, for most people, that first drug is marijauna), then you start to get more curious and consider doing other drugs more realistic, since you've already tried one.

I've seen this happen wayyy too many times.
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Old 12-14-2010, 07:31 AM  
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Originally Posted by Jake7 View Post
Pot definitely is a gateway drug...

I don't know why I get so invested in this - I know it's not going to happen!
In that it is illegal, and those inclined to break the law are apt to continue doing so?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian View Post
Seeing as this thread is in the Politics section, does no one else care whether or not the government legally has ANY say in ANYTHING we ingest, whether it's relatively harmless pot or very harmful methamphetamines?

The nature of the drug, whether it's dangerous or not or whether it's addictive or not, is moot when considering whether or not government has the legal authority to restrict it.

I remind you that back in 1918, the government recognized that it didn't have the authority to ban alcohol outright, so an amendment to the Constitution was ratified to give the Federal government authority to ban it. Today, our government doesn't bother with arcane concerns like worrying about the Supreme Law of the Land. But I digress.
I too am against prohibition, Portugal and a couple of other countries have proven the only people who want to get high are junkies, normal people don't have a hard day and start using heroin. I see how drug addicts live on the TV, I have no desire to replicate that, I don't see how anyone would, so why would the legalization of drugs change my mind? It would just cut down on the crime and victimization accompanying the illegal activities, if statistics from said countries count for anything.
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Old 12-14-2010, 10:21 AM  
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dont get me wrong, i pretty much agree, but you have to realize thatevery country is different. because something works in Portugal does not mean it will work here. communism works in china, so it should work here right?
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Old 12-14-2010, 11:29 AM  
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dont get me wrong, i pretty much agree, but you have to realize thatevery country is different. because something works in Portugal does not mean it will work here. communism works in china, so it should work here right?
Communism works for the Chinese government, I would think most people don't like it. China is interesting country, they have a tendency to over throw leaders who oppress them and live in opulence, not sure why they aren't going nuts now, unless communism has brain washed them, which it has.

It may not work here, but what's not working and what hasn't been working is what we are doing now. I think there are solutions, but it seems our bipartisan government only live to shoot down ideas and not make progress.

I merely cite them as an example, also every other country that has decriminalized is seeing benefit.

Why are we so different?
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Old 12-14-2010, 01:32 PM  
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Communism works for the Chinese government, I would think most people don't like it. China is interesting country, they have a tendency to over throw leaders who oppress them and live in opulence, not sure why they aren't going nuts now, unless communism has brain washed them, which it has.

It may not work here, but what's not working and what hasn't been working is what we are doing now. I think there are solutions, but it seems our bipartisan government only live to shoot down ideas and not make progress.

I merely cite them as an example, also every other country that has decriminalized is seeing benefit.

Why are we so different?
Unfortunately, that's very, very not true. There have been tons of countries that have seen terrible results.

When the Netherlands legalized marijuana, use among 18 to 20 year olds tripled, and their admissions to rehab facilities more than doubled within a year.

In the late 80's, the Swiss permitted drug use in a park called Zurich Park, or also called "Needle Park." Within a few years, the number of normal drug users at the park jumped from around 200 to 20,000 - it had become a magnet for druggies around the world. Within 5 years, crime had run so rampant that they had to shut the park down and terminate the "drug legalization experiment."

These are just two examples of how it's been terrible to legalize marijuana.

In 2002, Marijuana was the number two reason for being admitted into rehab - even more common than crack cocaine, which was number three. Pretty surprising for a "harmless drug."

Combine that with the fact that users who use marijuana are 63% more likely to use cocaine or other more serious drugs. compared with those who have never used marijuana are about 1% likely. So, in short, 63 of 100 people who have used marijuana will use cocaine or another harder drug, and approximately 1 in 100 who never use marijuana will ever use anything else. That is why it's called a gateway drug.

Talk about a novel! I'll be honest, I've used before. When I was younger. My time with it was a huge mistake, and I don't want my kids to make the same mistake. I realize marijuana isn't the root of ALL evil - most of the time, I'm sure it's harmless. However, the dangers on society and the person themselves can't be ignored. Numbers don't lie. I don't want my kids to be around that stuff.

I can honestly say that if marijuana would ever be legalized in the US, I would start filling out my immigration papers the same day.



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